Mike moving fighters..

[diamondandy]

Jeff_W ¦ but for those that still havent i'll just go and ask mike to move them. i hate taking his time away from important things, but he has said before that he doesnt mind preventing no contests manually

 

Just a snippet from the MMA Tycoon IRC Chat Room.

Something I have seen a few times and it really annoys me.

 

As an org owner you have a certain responsibility to ensure fighters are in the city at the time of the event etc.

If you find yourself have constant NC's then maybe you need to realise that you shouldn't be signing fighters who ain't based in your orgs city.

 

Yes you should be penalised, this is a Tycoon Management game, not a "I'm going to message Mike because a fighter doesn't want to travel to my city" game.

At the end of the day, we need orgs to be hit with NC's to allow other orgs to grow as well.

If your business decisions are failing you due to the fighters not turning up, then that is life.

[Guest]

How would you suggest that I "ensure fighters are in the city at the time of the event"?

 

Baring in mind these fighters agreed to fight in Rio specifically, and then decided not to move, and haven't moved even after I messaged then in-game with a reminder.

[Guest]

I fully agree. We had a nice little debate in chat about it that brought out many good points on both sides. I understand people who say, as the org owner, it's not my fault if he guy doesn't show up(or even if he's overweight since the discussion branched out) and I agree. It may not be your fault, but in my opinion, that's part of the risks of owning an org. Similar to business in real life, you don't control everything and you can be penalized for things that are beyond your control. I feel the same about tycoon, it may not be fair, but I don't see why Mike should spend time fixing it for you. Just my two cents, for whatever it's worth.

[diamondandy]

How would you suggest that I "ensure fighters are in the city at the time of the event"?

 

Baring in mind these fighters agreed to fight in Rio specifically, and then decided not to move, and haven't moved even after I messaged then in-game with a reminder.

 

Don't sign people from outside Rio?

It would help a lot in all honesty.

[DeadlyDirk]

To be honest I kind of agree.

 

While I think that as many things that can be done in game to help prevent no contests, such as fighters no longer being able to fly out of the city etc should be added to the game, I don't think it should be put right once it's too late just because someone forgot to take a flight. It sucks for sure, but the fighters and managers who cause them will stand out, it's part of the game.

 

I wouldn't PM Mike because I forgot to change my supplements for a fighter or because I forgot to order stock for my company.

[diamondandy]

Jeff_W ¦ good old Mike, just moved all of the fighters

 

and

 

Jeff_W ¦ dont blame me, im just doing what i need to do to ensure the fighters are in the right location

 

 

Ahhh looks like we have one smug org owner

 

This shit is seriously annoying.

[MattyBlayze]

I couldn't disagree more...

 

What is not being recognized here as this is completely out of the org owner's control. If you forget to "change supplements for a fighter or forget to order stock for your company" - that's on you. That's your mistake. You have to take ownership of your responsibilities.

 

With NCs, this is someone else committing an act (or not committing an act actually) that has detrimental effects on you while you have NO ability to right this wrong. I assume if someone is contacting Mike to help with a NC, that person has likely already PMed the offending manager several times to tell them to fly to the right city or to tell them to stop training and restore energy - that person, whether a douchenozzle or inactive, is not doing it.

 

And I say this not only as an org owner, but as a manager who has had fighters NC against me - it sucks! Why should I be screwed out of money and a fight and lose hype (by default of being inactive for so long) because someone else screws up?

[Guest]

I couldn't disagree more...

 

What is not being recognized here as this is completely out of the org owner's control. If you forget to "change supplements for a fighter or forget to order stock for your company" - that's on you. That's your mistake. You have to take ownership of your responsibilities.

 

With NCs, this is someone else committing an act (or not committing an act actually) that has detrimental effects on you while you have NO ability to right this wrong. I assume if someone is contacting Mike to help with a NC, that person has likely already PMed the offending manager several times to tell them to fly to the right city or to tell them to stop training and restore energy - that person, whether a douchenozzle or inactive, is not doing it.

 

And I say this not only as an org owner, but as a manager who has had fighters NC against me - it sucks! Why should I be screwed out of money and a fight and lose hype (by default of being inactive for so long) because someone else screws up?

 

It sucks when stuff is out of your control, but such is life. I just don't know why Mike should waste his time fixing it.

[Manfred]

I fully agree. We had a nice little debate in chat about it that brought out many good points on both sides. I understand people who say, as the org owner, it's not my fault if he guy doesn't show up(or even if he's overweight since the discussion branched out) and I agree. It may not be your fault, but in my opinion, that's part of the risks of owning an org. Similar to business in real life, you don't control everything and you can be penalized for things that are beyond your control. I feel the same about tycoon, it may not be fair, but I don't see why Mike should spend time fixing it for you. Just my two cents, for whatever it's worth.

 

That's how I feel. As the owner you can punish him by benching him and/or not rehiring him. Since they added the scheduler, there is no excuse. That said, It's my responsibility to check every week and PM the managers still out of the city within 2 days. If that's not enough, I have to go beg Mike but I treat the manager as if he NC'd me.

[Guest]

I had a NC on my first event and it was all my fault, I take responsibility as I signed 2 guys who didn't make weight.

 

So it was my mistake, I made the fights, I signed the fighters, never the less they were so worn out from over training they caused a NC.

 

I took it on the chin, a learning curve, I didn't message the managers saying wtf, all I did was send them a new contract for the 145lbs division.

 

Its the org owners responsibility and Mike should have said deal with it.

 

If Machida doesn't catch his flight to USA, and causes a NC against Couture, who would Dana turn to?

 

Shame should be here, if an org goes belly up, its not Mikes problem, there is a warning saying sign fighters in your own city.

 

And yeah that's smug from Jeff W, but he got what he wanted.

 

I admit I think I ballsed up by booking an event on the same day as another which I think was a mistake by the computer but Mike fixed it. If I thought it was my mistake I would have took it on the chin.

 

Great thread by the OP +1.

[MattyBlayze]

It sucks when stuff is out of your control, but such is life. I just don't know why Mike should waste his time fixing it.

 

Because in real life, I'd be able to do something to put it in my control - I could send the guy a plane ticket, I could switch the fight around, I could fine the offending fighter. Here, I can't.

 

I had a NC on my first event and it was all my fault, I take responsibility as I signed 2 guys who didn't make weight.

 

So it was my mistake, I made the fights, I signed the fighters, never the less they were so worn out from over training they caused a NC.

 

I took it on the chin, a learning curve, I didn't message the managers saying wtf, all I did was send them a new contract for the 145lbs division.

 

Its the org owners responsibility and Mike should have said deal with it.

 

If Machida doesn't catch his flight to USA, and causes a NC against Couture, who would Dana turn to?

 

Shame should be here, if an org goes belly up, its not Mikes problem, there is a warning saying sign fighters in your own city.

 

And yeah that's smug from Jeff W, but he got what he wanted.

 

I admit I think I ballsed up by booking an event on the same day as another which I think was a mistake by the computer but Mike fixed it. If I thought it was my mistake I would have took it on the chin.

 

Great thread by the OP +1.

 

I think you don't fully understand the breadth of the situation. This isn't a scenario where the org owner made a mistake - the org owner did nothing wrong. The org owner was being responsible (theoretically), and it still wasn't enough because of forces out of his control.

 

"If Machida doesn't catch his flight to USA, and causes a NC against Couture, who would Dana turn to? " Dana would turn to another fighter to step up in Machida's place! If you want the same in real life and here, then don't say "deal with it" - say "fix it"!

[Guest]

Erm, if your going to move fighters if org owners ask, why not just move them over automatically?

 

I'd personally not really want to message mike with this, and would rather org owners (me included) just deal with it, if it's causing that much of a problem for you then fire the fighter and stay clear of that manager, no big deal.. leave mike alone, doesn't need to be doing this, get over it I'd suggest... Basically just favours the org owners who want to waste Mikes time imo.

[Guest]

Its the org owners responsibility. I've had a nc fixed before when and only when both fighters messaged mike to agree to cancel the fight otherwise nothing could have been done. but I agree with op

[MattyBlayze]

Erm, if your going to move fighters if org owners ask, why not just move them over automatically?

 

I'd personally not really want to message mike with this, and would rather org owners (me included) just deal with it, if it's causing that much of a problem for you then fire the fighter and stay clear of that manager, no big deal.. leave mike alone, doesn't need to be doing this, get over it I'd suggest... Basically just favours the org owners who want to waste Mikes time imo.

 

Now, we're talking! I've been a proponent of this for a long, long time - and there are numerous threads like this where you can search and see the discussion.

 

Obviously, being a game, we can't be totally realistic - if a fighter doesn't show up, we can't have org owners picking a replacement fighter at the last second; however, if a fighter were to miss weight, instead of a NC, the fight should take place at a catchweight with a fine imposed on the offending fighter, or if the fighter doesn't arrive on schedule, the org owner pays the cost for a one way flight and the offending fighter gets fined and loses energy/morale, etc.

 

Don't get me wrong - I agree Mike shouldn't be bothered with these minor issues, but I also don't believe its acceptable to tell org owners to "deal with it".

[Guest]

+1 Riddlez

[Guest]

It sucks when stuff is out of your control, but such is life. I just don't know why Mike should waste his time fixing it.

 

 

Because he is choosing to do so? He does get to pick how he spends his time you know.

 

If he didn't want to, he wouldn't. How this has escaped the grasp of some in here is blowing me away.

 

Do you think the org owner *forced* Mike to do this? You guys seem to think org owners have crazy enforcement powers that not only should be able to magically prevent NC's but that can warp the fabric of real life time and space enough to zombify Mike Tycoon into doing their bidding.

I must be missing the wiki section on where org owners manage that.

[Guest]

Because he is choosing to do so? He does get to pick how he spends his time you know.

 

If he didn't want to, he wouldn't. How this has escaped the grasp of some in here is blowing me away.

 

Do you think the org owner *forced* Mike to do this? You guys seem to think org owners have crazy enforcement powers that not only should be able to magically prevent NC's but that can warp the fabric of real life time and space enough to zombify Mike Tycoon into doing their bidding.

I must be missing the wiki section on where org owners manage that.

 

It hasn't "escaped" me that he chooses how to spend his time. I just feel that org owners should stop messaging him asking to do this. If they didn't message him surely this wouldn't be getting done. And the other part of my post was also to say that I wish Mike would spend time on other things other than this. Obviously he can pick how he handles things, but we can't offer our opinions on where time would be better spent? Thanks for adding to this discussion.

[MattyBlayze]

To play devil's advocate...

 

Something that has come up a few times before is NCs in fights due to low blows or inadvertent head-butts, for example. While realistic, this has been shrugged at by many (including Mike) because it it would create situations where there would be occurrences that are detrimental to your fighter beyond your control.

 

How is that any different than a fighter NCing in an org? An occurrence that is detrimental to the org beyond an org owner's control.

 

Is it safe to assume that everyone who has posted in this thread (basically) telling org owners to deal with it would be in favor of adding random NCs due to low blows, and everyone who has posted saying something should be done to give org owners control over NCs would be against this?

[Guest]

No I think that is too drastic random NC's, the point I tried to make is when you offer a contract at the top it says:

 

Note: book fighters from your own location when

you're starting up. Fighters do not magically appear

in your event location come fight time so if they're in

another location, they'll have to fly over (which costs

a lot of money). That costs money so make sure the

fighter can afford it and that the manager knows he

will need to fly the fighter out come fight time.

 

Its a clear warning, imo.

 

I take Matty's opinion on board, and I hope Matty you see my point also that an org owner has to shoulder the blame also.

 

I think this is a great discussion and thus far has remained peaceful.

 

How long will it last.

[Guest]

On not letting fighters fly out of a city, my fighter fought a fight in Montreal and accepted another a week later in Montreal. My fighter is based in New York. I only needed a pair of sessions to recover from the last fight, but I was stuck in Montreal because you can't fly out of a city 7 days before a fight.

[Guest]

an org owner has to shoulder the blame also

 

Surely the org owner should only shoulder the blame when they actually are to blame? If an org owner books a fight when a fighter is in the wrong location, then fine. But if the org owner and manager agreed prior to the contract/fight that it would be in a different location, and the org owner reminded the user about getting on a flight, and still they didn't... why is it right to punish the org owner when the blame lays squarely with the manager?

[Guest]

Because he is choosing to do so? He does get to pick how he spends his time you know.

 

If he didn't want to, he wouldn't. How this has escaped the grasp of some in here is blowing me away.

 

Do you think the org owner *forced* Mike to do this? You guys seem to think org owners have crazy enforcement powers that not only should be able to magically prevent NC's but that can warp the fabric of real life time and space enough to zombify Mike Tycoon into doing their bidding.

I must be missing the wiki section on where org owners manage that.

read this: (this is straight out of mike tycoons mouth)

 

 

Just a note to say that I'm getting too many requests to deal with stuff which is minor and unimportant. Reqests to deal with contract issues, free agents' new managers not wanting to fight etc etc.

 

So please, if you're having problems but it's nothing to do with the game programming, so nothing has gone wrong with the game, please resolve it without contracting me or just work through it. Imagine this is a game you bought from the shop and I don't exist - sometimes things happen which are a pain to deal with but you can't ring up EA Sports and ask them to help.

 

Anyway, from now on I'm just ignoring requests for stuff which isn't an actual problem with the game. Writing replies to messags is easily the most mentally draining part of running the site. Often it takes as much time to reply with "that's really not something that I should be dealing with etc" and justifying that decision, so now I'll just be ignoring unimportant stuff to preserve the enthusiasm I have for improving the site.

 

Thanks for your understanding

 

 

im pretty certain that mike says that if it's not a programming issue then you need to just work through it. a real life person forgetting to fly their fighter for a fight isnt a programming issue. its a contract issue

 

i'd say the reason why he fixes most ppl's problems still, is because he doesnt want to piss ppl off. although he's obviously yearning to not have to do it anymore. at least that's how i take his remarks anyways

[Guest]

read this: (this is straight out of mike tycoons mouth)

 

 

Just a note to say that I'm getting too many requests to deal with stuff which is minor and unimportant. Reqests to deal with contract issues, free agents' new managers not wanting to fight etc etc.

 

So please, if you're having problems but it's nothing to do with the game programming, so nothing has gone wrong with the game, please resolve it without contracting me or just work through it. Imagine this is a game you bought from the shop and I don't exist - sometimes things happen which are a pain to deal with but you can't ring up EA Sports and ask them to help.

 

Anyway, from now on I'm just ignoring requests for stuff which isn't an actual problem with the game. Writing replies to messags is easily the most mentally draining part of running the site. Often it takes as much time to reply with "that's really not something that I should be dealing with etc" and justifying that decision, so now I'll just be ignoring unimportant stuff to preserve the enthusiasm I have for improving the site.

 

Thanks for your understanding

 

 

im pretty certain that mike says that if it's not a programming issue then you need to just work through it. a real life person forgetting to fly their fighter for a fight isnt a programming issue. its a contract issue

 

i'd say the reason why he fixes most ppl's problems still, is because he doesnt want to piss ppl off. although he's obviously yearning to not have to do it anymore. at least that's how i take his remarks anyways

 

 

Know what is missing there? Any mentions of fixing NC's.

 

Pretty obviously he is not placing them in the same category or he wouldn't be responding at all let alone fixing this.

 

Pasting that means nothing because Mike's actions are speaking a ton louder than those words.

 

If he didn't want to be fixing these, he would not be fixing them.

 

He is fixing them, it is his time, his decision, and his game.

 

The alternative would be to have even more automagic enforcement mechanisms programmed into the game to prevent managers from NC'ing. I am not against that necessarily (it would be pretty complex though) but he has pretty clearly chosen to manually fix NCs for the time being.

 

If he didn't want to, his response (or rather the lack of one) as spelled out above would stop owners from asking him to fix them.

 

To speculate about why he might doing that well, I think he intends the game to be about orgs that span cities and not to allow the threat of unpreventable NCs to keep orgs completely provincial. Lost amongst all the sanctimony about "only sign people in your home city!" is the fact that a fighter can move out of a city or fly to another one to train at any bloody time after signing. The org owner currently has no mechanism to prevent that or even punish those who NC due to stupidity, inattention, or because they have left the game.

 

Preventing retarded NC's from gutting an org's big event when they have zero recourse to fix it on their own is good for the game, not bad for it.

[Guest]

......

whatever you choose to believe is up to you. but i consider a NC a definate contract issue? and even if not showing up for a fight that you are contracted to show up for isnt a contract issue then it's still certainly not a programming issue. which mike clearly says that that's all he cares to deal with.

 

but you're right. it's his time and he can spend it however he wants. makes zero difference to me really. just figured i'd post some relevant information....if you deem it not relevant. then that's up to you as well

[PBR]

maybe he can fix it where a n/c doesnt hurt a card -- im kind of against a fighter magically appearing for a fight but agree that it hurts who he is suppose to fight, org owner but not really himself -- maybe something worked out that the fighter ready gets paid show up pay and make it where the n/c doesnt hurt the card -- but the fighter causing the n/c loses hype and rank as if he lost and no pay -- having a fighter just appear isnt right and as stated takes away from mikes time, not that he probably cares or that it even bothers him --- and yes i have n/c'ed myself on accident before