redo the coaches for gyms

[Guest]

at the momment anyone who has enough money gainned over time can open his own gym and straight away employ single , double, triple elite coaches and fill up his coaching roster in a matter on five mins.

this is highly unrealistic and only serves to create monsters .

think of any football manager game and you have to go into the market to pick up your coaches , negotiate contracts etc and all are not elite in everything they do.

 

what i propose goes hand in hand with what mike has mentioned in previous posts in the fact fighter slots could be expanded to 20 but with five non fighting.

 

now the game is comming to the end of its first generation fighters why not have the option to convert them to coaches , ? either for your own gym or for people to hire off you for thier gyms?

If when the game started first , there wasnt an option to employ faceless elite coaches but you employed them from a pool this would be easy to bring in ,.but nearly every gym in the game is elite orientated so i dont know how you would bring this in.

 

for instance a lot of 30 year old fighters are exeptional or sensational in all four skills but very few are elite in two or even three skills.

but there are an awfull lot of free agents kicking about at 30 years old that will just go in the bin , it would be great if we could use them in some way to replace the elite coaches we now have in every gym , consider the experience ex fighters would have over "elite coaches"

this would then be a more realistic fight manager game as the gym owner would then have to constanly look for better coaches , offer contracts , etc.

 

its radical to say the least but it would open up a whole new aspect of gym managment , and it would give a manager the option to still make money out of a fighter he has owned and trainned for years and make it as realistic as it gets

[Guest]

i'd be very suprised if this wasnt how the game was going to end up anyways. now is a great time to do it. hell, it could have been done long ago really. the retired fighter pool is definately deep enough.

 

where this type of system would really shine is now that we have fighter maintenance in place. so when fighters end their careers they are really going to have unique skill sets.

 

it would also put an absolute end to the triple elite thing for clinchwork. because with this you'd be picking up an actual fighter. either he has clinchwork skills or he doesnt. if he does then he teaches it to your fighters just like he'd teach takedowns or subs or any other skill.

 

i kinda feel like it should be limited to only retired fighters though. then when a fighter has exhausted his fighting potential then he could move on to coaching if someone wants him. maybe some sort of a $'s per skill point formula could be used for signing fee and wage? just to keep things uniform

 

it would definately make every gym unique and add A LOT more fun and strategy to running a gym

 

this is one of those ideas that i feel like will innevitably happen. it actually really stinks because we'll probly have to wait a long time before we can enjoy it. wish it could just be as easy as snapping fingers and it was done

[Guest]

at the momment anyone who has enough money gainned over time can open his own gym and straight away employ single , double, triple elite coaches and fill up his coaching roster in a matter on five mins.

this is highly unrealistic and only serves to create monsters .

think of any football manager game and you have to go into the market to pick up your coaches , negotiate contracts etc and all are not elite in everything they do.

 

what i propose goes hand in hand with what mike has mentioned in previous posts in the fact fighter slots could be expanded to 20 but with five non fighting.

 

now the game is comming to the end of its first generation fighters why not have the option to convert them to coaches , ? either for your own gym or for people to hire off you for thier gyms?

If when the game started first , there wasnt an option to employ faceless elite coaches but you employed them from a pool this would be easy to bring in ,.but nearly every gym in the game is elite orientated so i dont know how you would bring this in.

 

for instance a lot of 30 year old fighters are exeptional or sensational in all four skills but very few are elite in two or even three skills.

but there are an awfull lot of free agents kicking about at 30 years old that will just go in the bin , it would be great if we could use them in some way to replace the elite coaches we now have in every gym , consider the experience ex fighters would have over "elite coaches"

this would then be a more realistic fight manager game as the gym owner would then have to constanly look for better coaches , offer contracts , etc.

 

its radical to say the least but it would open up a whole new aspect of gym managment , and it would give a manager the option to still make money out of a fighter he has owned and trainned for years and make it as realistic as it gets

 

You have the germ of an idea here but I think you would do well top pull back on the rambling a bit and put it down in a focused manner because right now you are essentially just suggesting:

 

You can hire your own players or pimp them out!

 

 

Which is fine but how exactly does that mitigate the problem you started out discussing (in bold above)?

 

So I could hire a Triple Elite Clinch coach or have a player coach who is what... Maybe Single Elite? If I have money I am still going with the Triple Elite faceless dude. If I don't have money I could go with my own guy I suppose but not sure what the gain would be over hiring a coach...?

 

Do I not have to pay my guys? If so, you will just see even more private gym popping up as you have simply lowered the financial bar to entry by the cost of 5 free coaches.

 

Or are you suggesting that we can *only* hire ex-players? In that case the rich will really dominate like never before because the retired fighter supply will be far tighter at the top end and will be dominated by bids from the folks with cash (leading us back to the bold part of you statement)

[EzekelRAGE]

How do we know that the coaches we hired aren't previous fighters?

[Guest]

you miss interprit my intensions , i did say , it would be hard to bring in , but why should people be able to hire triple elites? it doesnt happen in real life , and if you had to go shopping for coaches off other managers it makes the game more.

this was a suggestion that i thought would make the game more realistic and should have been done on the outset.

looking at it , you could go about it like this , say for instance a fighter retires and has kod 12 fighters and has sensational boxing , he should be better than an on a shelf elite boxing coach because he has know how?

it would take a while for the on the shelf elites to disapear but they would eventualy , would you want a coach that has just came out of coach 101 boxing school , or a ex fighter who has kod 12 fighters in his career.

 

my suggestion was meant to make the game more of a sim for gym owners rather than i got money so im going to open a 12 fighter elite gym with 12 elite coaches? do you not see that?

agreed money will come into it , but alliances will play a massive part as well , and i know mike wants to promote alliances , those who band togehter sort of thing.

 

 

all i am asking you to is consider it for a momment ? i am a gym owner myself and have been for the last three years and i consider my gym to be in the top five in the game , but i am suggesting this?

it doesnt do me no favours but it would be a massive addition to the game and possibly change the whole game dynamics.

just consider it before you think of yourself and think of the game in the longrun

[Krimzn]

So instead of retiring them, you would get the option to stick them into coach slots? Kind of like coaches in high school or college who have retired but want to pass on their knowledge, right?

 

If that's the case, in addition to this, how about a "Create a Coach" option and players would have to pay money to send them to training (2 weeks for lower levels that gradually increase length of training as their knowledge increases). Like Competent coaches would get sent to training for 3 weeks and when they return, they'll be Respectable in their coaching style. Or they could start coaching with their knowledge right out of the gate. They could become sparring partners or something along those lines. Of course, money would play a part in this but in this world (and in the real world), that's just how it goes. Like the mentor system, there should be certain requirements you must achieve before you are allowed to create coaches or use the coach slots. Example: Been a part of MMATycoon for at least a year, has 3 fighters with 20-30 fights each, a fighter that reached age 30. Something along those lines.

 

I, personally, really enjoy this idea and hope that it gets expanded to a certain degree so it is suitable for the game. Of course there will be cons but there's pros and cons with everything. This would really bring a whole new level to the game and maybe open up more gyms with lower level training (for lower level fighters looking for the most out of their training). +1 to this.

[Guest]

but why should people be able to hire triple elites? it doesnt happen in real life , and if you had to go shopping for coaches off other managers it makes the game more.

 

it would take a while for the on the shelf elites to disapear but they would eventualy , would you want a coach that has just came out of coach 101 boxing school , or a ex fighter who has kod 12 fighters in his career.

 

 

 

 

I clipped all but the bits that are important. So what you are saying is:

 

You want to do away with being able to hire computer coaches at all from here on out and only be able to hire player coaches.

 

You also somehow think that someone with say a Triple Elite computer coach already hired would for some reason want to replace them with a player coach who stands exactly zero chance of being Triple Elite (not a single Triple Elite fighter in the Game to my knowledge, but feel free to post one if you have one or know of one).

 

Ergo...

 

Somewhere you are positing a change that would make a player coach of a given level say... Elite Bx/Sens MT/Excep WR *better* than a computer coach which is Elite x 3 in all those same disciplines.

 

Not saying this can't be done, just making a plea for a ton more clarity and concrete thought in your suggestions.

 

Fewer words and shorter thoughts would likely serve you well.

[Guest]

he's basically saying that we do away with computer generated coaches and consider using retired fighters as coaches. i personally think it's a very neat idea

[Guest]

he's basically saying that we do away with computer generated coaches and consider using retired fighters as coaches. i personally think it's a very neat idea

 

 

It is also an idea without much of a framework or coherence in here. Mike is suggesting fighters be added as an augmentation to add new features to gyms in addition to the coaching system we already have.

 

If the OP is going to suggest a major sweeping change to the game at least post something more than a page of stream of consciousness word spew that we have to wade through to pick out even the germ of an idea.

 

You just stated his *entire* improvement suggestion in one sentence of 18 words when it took the OP two posts and 686 words to actually articulate those two concepts.

 

It needs a metric ton more fleshing out than that one sentence can do though.

 

The example I posted is a good starting place:

 

We would either have to :

 

A. Force every existing gym to fire all the coaches they paid for so that the computer coaches who are all Elite in at least one discipline (mostly at least two) would not simply be retained because they are better than the 99.9% of retired fighters (especially after tickers came in).

 

OR

 

B. Contrive a very elaborate system wherein retired players coaches are some how better at teaching skills than that Triple Elite computer coach I already have.

 

OR

 

C. Let the player coaches be less skilled but make them free of charge if they are yours. Note that this would simply lower the bar to entry to the Private gym club and make it so that even fewer public gyms are available.

 

 

 

I could go on and on. The Improvement as stated (and I am using that term very liberally here) by the OP is the merest ghost of an idea with holes so large that a semi could slide through them sideways.

 

 

I love radical suggestions but for the love of god at least take as much time to compose your ideas as it does to read through the post for the rest of us.

[EzekelRAGE]

this would also mean less pops :/

[Guest]

that's understandable. maybe i just understood it easier because me and mrblack both type with no capatilization and my eyes are more adjusted to it? where as you read with no comprehension because your brain is less adjusted for it? -- sorry that's 100% just a joke. i had to say it though

[Guest]

of course it has holes in it ? and i did state it world be hard to bring in ,

but you could for instance have all coaches on set time contracts , when computer generated coaches contracts expire they dont get renewed for instance.

this is an idea and its here for people to mull over ,.

on the same subject at the momment gyms are only allowed 12 coaches ? why not expand that to fifteen but only 12 can be active at one time.

now some people will say whats the point in this ? there is a very good point to it if you have ever owned a gym and have had to sack and rehire coaches , this would especialy help the newer gym owners in the game , also it would allow gyms to be more diverse if they choose to be.

[DaBest]

So basically because there are some monsters on here you want to take away the coaches? (I don't have any monsters) I mean only the top managers would be able to get the best fighters on their way to retirement. Then you would have good fighters versus some really big bums! That kind of seems what this looks like. If they were to quit allowing the coaches we currently have, I know I would quite playing this game. The top players would only get better and the lower rated players would only get worse!

[ArtieBanks]

In a football manager game tho the rich dominate, they get the cream of the crop youth, the best coaches avaliable and they in turn will create even more monsters for the best fighters in the game and the poor/medium guys wont get any better they will just get a lot worse.

[Guest]

So basically because there are some monsters on here you want to take away the coaches? (I don't have any monsters) I mean only the top managers would be able to get the best fighters on their way to retirement. Then you would have good fighters versus some really big bums! That kind of seems what this looks like. If they were to quit allowing the coaches we currently have, I know I would quite playing this game. The top players would only get better and the lower rated players would only get worse!

 

 

In a football manager game tho the rich dominate, they get the cream of the crop youth, the best coaches avaliable and they in turn will create even more monsters for the best fighters in the game and the poor/medium guys wont get any better they will just get a lot worse.

i disagree. there's a bunch of retired fighters in the game. over 100,000 of them i assume. i dont see where rich managers would prosper from it any more than a poor manager would? but i may be seeing it different than you guys?

[DaBest]

I'm not saying that we shouldn't be able to hire these retired fighters, but I don't see why doing away with the current coaches we have would be beneficial.. Maybe being able to hire the retired fighters would be something that could help fighters pop a little faster to a certain degree. However just to say get rid of the elite coaches we have now is rediculous. I say if we do that then we just need to do a complete system reset, "make every person on the game start from scratch on every single aspect" like fighters, companies, money, absolutely everything! I know that people on here don't want to do that. Otherwise it's always going to be the same as it is now, the top are always going to be at the top and nothing will have been effected.

 

Perhaps each gym could hire 2 retired fighters to add to there already 12 coaches or something of that nature, but I don't see the reason for managers being able to have 20 fighter slots and 5 of them become retired fighter slots.

[Guest]

I think it would be a great idea to use retired fighters as coaches and do away with the computer coaches, although coding that might not reach mikes top list if he decided the idea is viable

 

as a gym owner myself It would give me a side activity, scouting for coaches to better my gym each day, but I think this one would be just a dream, since nothing beats a computer elite coach.

[Krimzn]

But that's the thing. The attraction of new players based on this current system is mediocre at best. With the addition of new features (such as this), it will help the appeal of the game. For the majority of things to be user run, gives you a lot to do. Therefore you won't get bored meaning that sticking to the game will be more likely.

 

All those players using triple elites are definitely top tier but what about those that don't have that luxury? Even if you replace the coaches with retired coaches, the rich would still dominate because they can afford high end coaches.

 

So how about if instead of automatically sacking them as a free agent, you have the ability to add them as a coach? Doing so will allow other players to hire them and you would earn money per week depending on the negotiations set forth by the buyer and seller. This will add an additional (needed) money sink. Gym owners will be able to see coaches stats prior to making their purchase so they know what they getting.

 

There are already quad sensationals running about that's probably on par with triple elites. I really believe this is an incredible idea and will do wonders for the future of the game. But that's just my opinion.

[Guest]

 

 

There are already quad sensationals running about that's probably on par with triple elites. I really believe this is an incredible idea and will do wonders for the future of the game. But that's just my opinion.

 

I think you wildly overestimate the numbers here.

 

 

Top 10 fighters in the game and their skill levels:

 

Sens/Sens/Ex/Purple

Sens/Sens/Sens/Brown

Sens/Sens/Won/Purple

Sens/Sens/Won/Purple

Elite/Elite/Won/Purple

Sens/Ex/Sens/Black

Elite/Sens/Sens/Brown

Sens/Sens/Ex/Brown

Sens/Sup/Won/Purple

Elite/Sens/Rem/Purple

 

 

Out of the 10 best fighters in the game there are 2 triple Sensationals. They also belong to some of the game's richest and most successful managers who already have access to the very best training possible.

 

While I am in favor of adding player coaches and expanding the roles they would have, what exactly would dumping computer coaches do again?

 

 

I also assume we are imply that skill deterioration would freeze when they go into coaching and that coming out of retirement would be made impossible. If we didn't, then folks would use coach slots as a "deep freeze" to keep old guys that might be great again from dropping skills.

[DaBest]

There is still simply no reason to sack the computer coaches though. There is no logical reason to do this. If we do this now, the fighters that are already built to a very high level will still be at a very high level and the new fighters and managers that everyone seems to be so concerned with will come in to train with guys that are worse the some of the current fighters that are still fighting. So wheres the advantage at here? There are so many new money sinks coming into the game soon that we don't need another dumb one like this. The are going to be implementing a housing fee for fighters, they are currently in the works of creating planes of all types that are going to cost a ton to use. So with the training being changed like that is only going to continue to benefit the top guys. I almost guarntee that a good percentage of people on here would just about quit playing do to this. I've been around for a long time now and have no interest in it. The new comers just wouldn't stand a chance against most of the fighters currently made that have been training for a couple of months.

[DougSupreme]

You have the germ of an idea here but I think you would do well top pull back on the rambling a bit and put it down in a focused manner because right now you are essentially just suggesting:

 

You can hire your own players or pimp them out!

 

 

Which is fine but how exactly does that mitigate the problem you started out discussing (in bold above)?

 

So I could hire a Triple Elite Clinch coach or have a player coach who is what... Maybe Single Elite? If I have money I am still going with the Triple Elite faceless dude. If I don't have money I could go with my own guy I suppose but not sure what the gain would be over hiring a coach...?

 

Do I not have to pay my guys? If so, you will just see even more private gym popping up as you have simply lowered the financial bar to entry by the cost of 5 free coaches.

 

Or are you suggesting that we can *only* hire ex-players? In that case the rich will really dominate like never before because the retired fighter supply will be far tighter at the top end and will be dominated by bids from the folks with cash (leading us back to the bold part of you statement)

 

Maybe the coaching skill should be less about the Primary skill and more about the secondary. A fighter with Elite Boxing and Elite punches wouldn't be as valuable for teaching Striking Defense as a Fighter with Elite Boxing and Elite Strike D.

[Guest]

Maybe the coaching skill should be less about the Primary skill and more about the secondary. A fighter with Elite Boxing and Elite punches wouldn't be as valuable for teaching Striking Defense as a Fighter with Elite Boxing and Elite Strike D.

 

 

I would agree there. The coaching could stand to be more nuanced (provided we are not caring about how complex the game is to newbs anyways) and overall I think using player based coaches would be great but only after a total server/world reset or the introduction of a new server. Changes this drastic would be difficult if not impossible to integrate into this existing milieu.

[Guest]

I would agree there. The coaching could stand to be more nuanced (provided we are not caring about how complex the game is to newbs anyways) and overall I think using player based coaches would be great but only after a total server/world reset or the introduction of a new server. Changes this drastic would be difficult if not impossible to integrate into this existing milieu.

i dont think that it'd be that hard actually. the training speed can easily be sped up or slowed down. it would take almost nothing for mike to just simply speed up the training to make it the same as it is now with computer generated coaches. i think ppl a lot of times get too gridlocked thinking inside a shell for how things have to be. in my opinion nothing is out of bounds or cant be changed if a better situation comes along

 

 

i think that a new world is the answer to a lot of this games problems. but it's not really a good idea to introduce it until a lot of the major bugs are worked out of this one. but a new world is definately a good idea down the road

[Guest]

i dont think that it'd be that hard actually. the training speed can easily be sped up or slowed down. it would take almost nothing for mike to just simply speed up the training to make it the same as it is now with computer generated coaches. i think ppl a lot of times get too gridlocked thinking inside a shell for how things have to be. in my opinion nothing is out of bounds or cant be changed if a better situation comes along

 

 

EF, you totally missed the point actually being made. Even if Mike fiddled around *forever* with some equation that attempted to make player coaches with skill values far below triple Elite match the existing Triple Elite computer coaches the bitching about how that would be balanced would make the ticker thread look like peanuts.

 

 

If you were going to have player coaches in the manner suggested (directly slotted against computer coaches) then you would be about 20 million times better off starting from scratch.

[Guest]

there is some good feedback on this and it was meant for people to post thier thoughts.

 

but just to put the record straight

 

i myself have run gti-elite in london for over two years , all my coaches are 150 elites , and all my fighters are in my own gym , however i need to have other fighters in the gym to balance the books.

I am currently ranked 6th in the game and havnt been outside the top 20 for the last six months.

 

and i am the origonal poster of this thread? so for me to propose this would effect myself more than most other people.

 

but the idea is a good one in the fact it would get rid of the triple elite fixation everyone has including myself , the idea of secondaries playing a part in the ex fighter coaches ability to teach is something i hadnt thought about but its a great addition

sesational boxing/punch tec would be on par with elite boxing coach and there are 1000s of old fighters with these stats.

 

also consider if you convert one of your fighters to a coach and lets say he is hired off you for $4000 a week , he will pay for four of your younger fighters to train with supps and clothing.

so a new manager could delve into the free agency list , pick up an old fighter , convert him to a coach , and in turn that new coach would help finance his other fighters.

 

and , all the talk of speeding up the game , changing tickers , etc , so that all fighters dont end up the same in the end would go away