Different learning speeds

[Nutter]

Hey all

I'm looking for advice from you vets.

Do fighters have different learning speeds for different skills?

I notice that one of my guys has a quick learning speed (got to around 7.5 from 1 in one session) for almost all skills, but is much slower (c3.5) for Escapes. Escapes was a 1:1 training session from a coach that is 150 elite in wrestling and BJJ, which should be optimal.

Can anyone help me to understand what is going on?

Thanks! 

 

 

[Rocket]

are you measuring speed on an 18year old fighter for their first session 1 - 1 in each skill?

[Daudy]

A few things:

1) I believe people used to say test learning on anything except escapes. Apparently it is just a bit borked?

2) Is your energy maxed and your morale 100? You don't have to always train at 100% energy (though I recommend above 90), but make sure you're doing like for like comparisons. I think morale in particular has a big effect too.

3) Not specific to your example, but physical training is separate from learning speed of your secondaries. So in that way, there is such a thing as different learning speed

4) As Rocket said, make sure you're comparing 1 to 1. Most people test on skills with 1 out of 150 in them. If you've got a couple more points in there (which can also happen via sparring), it can make it look like you have much better learning speed than you really do.

[Nutter]

Thanks both. 

To confirm, I tested 5 skills.

All were at 1 out of 150 at the start.

All were 1:1 with a coach who was elite in all the relevant skills.

4 of them came up with identical results. The only anomalous one was Escapes, which was much slower. 

[Nutter]

46 minutes ago, Daudy said:

A few things:

1) I believe people used to say test learning on anything except escapes. Apparently it is just a bit borked?

2) Is your energy maxed and your morale 100? You don't have to always train at 100% energy (though I recommend above 90), but make sure you're doing like for like comparisons. I think morale in particular has a big effect too.

3) Not specific to your example, but physical training is separate from learning speed of your secondaries. So in that way, there is such a thing as different learning speed

4) As Rocket said, make sure you're comparing 1 to 1. Most people test on skills with 1 out of 150 in them. If you've got a couple more points in there (which can also happen via sparring), it can make it look like you have much better learning speed than you really do.

Is Escapes still borked? 

Is that only in terms of learning, or effect too?

Sorry to load so many questions onto you!

[Daudy]

I can't definitively say for sure because I never bothered to test it myself, but I do remember when I started playing again last year and taking the game more seriously, I did hear a number of people say NOT to test using escapes for learning speed. I never bothered to really quantify any differences or explore why, but maybe this is exactly why.

[jjsquirrel]

I know escapes used to be slower to train a couple years ago when I was building fighters. I thought it had been fixed, but apparently not.

[Rei]

Originally they used to train super fast, I guess mike overnerfed it when he went to return them to normal speeds

[Nutter]

Dammit. Thanks guys. I'll report this.

Edit: I've reported it here, in case anyone wants to follow up.

Edited August 2, 2023 by Nutter
Edited to add a link to the error report.

[Bob Slay]

Escapes appears to train at about the same speed as everything else for me, though I avoid using it for learning speed testing because of reading about those past problems, at varying points in time it has been faster than the other skills, slower & the same speed according to various managers.

Learning speed test is only for skills with just a single point placed in it at creation & not trained further prior to learning speed testing.

The higher the skill gets the slower it will train on a gradient curve, it takes far longer to train 71-150 than it does from 1-70.

[Nutter]

13 minutes ago, Skuzbukit said:

Escapes appears to train at about the same speed as everything else for me, though I avoid using it for learning speed testing because of reading about those past problems, at varying points in time it has been faster than the other skills, slower & the same speed according to various managers.

Learning speed test is only for skills with just a single point placed in it at creation & not trained further prior to learning speed testing.

The higher the skill gets the slower it will train on a gradient curve, it takes far longer to train 71-150 than it does from 1-70.

I understand. 

As above, I tested it with only a single point placed at creation, and it was not trained prior to learning speed testing.

I tested Kicks, Elbows, Punches, Striking Defence and Escapes, all of which were at 1 prior to testing. The first four resulted in identical scores of 7.5. Escapes resulted in 3.5.

All coaches were 150 elites in the relevant skills.

I wouldn't mind if it was close, but that's a massive discrepancy.

[Bob Slay]

Yeah that pretty much confirms why the advice has largely been to not use escapes for discovering learning speed.

I'm not sure that escapes being that low is a bug, it could very well be intentional.

[Nutter]

On 8/2/2023 at 9:14 PM, Skuzbukit said:

Yeah that pretty much confirms why the advice has largely been to not use escapes for discovering learning speed.

I'm not sure that escapes being that low is a bug, it could very well be intentional.

Thank you - I think you're right about not using escapes to measure learning speed!

I can't see how it could be intentional. Why would one skill be intentionally so much slower to learn than the others? And why would it be entirely unrelated to learning speed? 

I'd welcome any insight - am I missing something? 

 

[Daudy]

There are a number of inconsistencies around in the game, but they're slowly being addressed now that Mike and Rush are working together.

This specific difference could also be because Escapes was added a bit later than some of the other skills from what I've been told. So when it was put into the game, maybe it was just done a bit differently and that may or may not be intentional.

[Nutter]

Thanks Daudy. 

So it's a bug, but something likely to be addressed? I guess the lesson is to be intentional when it comes to the escapes skill?