Guest Posted September 3, 2011 Report Share Posted September 3, 2011 Other way around for me actually. Pretty curious indeed. Almost as if, oh, I dunno, SLIDERS had something to do with it. Nah, that's just silly of me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 3, 2011 Report Share Posted September 3, 2011 What does the semi-popular cult TV show, have to do with securing takedowns? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 3, 2011 Report Share Posted September 3, 2011 I was reading to this topic througout the week and now, after my today's fight I can say with no doubts: TKD's issue is TRUE!!! Here's the fight: http://mmatycoon.com/fightcommentary.php?FTID=348647 Only 1/11 Takedown attempts (9%), I expected at least 4 tkds! Here's Rivera's previous fight, before new fight engine: http://mmatycoon.com/fightcommentary.php?FTID=337626 6/16 Takedowns (37,5%), and both opponents (Equinox and Antona) have similar skills: Remarkable Wrestling with at least Exceptional Tkd Defense. So Mike, please fix it asap... I won't accept any fights for my grapplers by now, maybe release them, although they are all well rounded. I feel very sorry for those who enjoys and have only ground fighters! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RodrigoMachado Posted September 3, 2011 Report Share Posted September 3, 2011 He came into the fight on no energy, and was gassed within the first few seconds. He came with full energy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 3, 2011 Report Share Posted September 3, 2011 Mr Muscle, what was your takedown % set at if you don't mind me asking? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 3, 2011 Report Share Posted September 3, 2011 Something must be done before we turn to K-1 Tycoon! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 3, 2011 Report Share Posted September 3, 2011 Mr Muscle, what was your takedown % set at if you don't mind me asking? Np, it was 20%... for the previous fight 30%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 3, 2011 Report Share Posted September 3, 2011 Have any people been trying about the 10% mark? It's fine saying you want Mike to fix it saying 'look at my fight, its broken' but without the info it'll be hard to pinpoint Start linking fights with the aggression % and takedown % (or pm it me if you don't want it public) and ill put all the stats together with links etc and post something for Mike to make it easier to see if there is a problem and if there's a pattern Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 3, 2011 Report Share Posted September 3, 2011 Have any people been trying about the 10% mark? It's fine saying you want Mike to fix it saying 'look at my fight, its broken' but without the info it'll be hard to pinpoint Start linking fights with the aggression % and takedown % (or pm it me if you don't want it public) and ill put all the stats together with links etc and post something for Mike to make it easier to see if there is a problem and if there's a pattern So by now the maximum tkd % should be 10%, even if you have a huge advantage in the ground?? I'm sorry but it makes no sense, I'd rather release my grapplers and pick up strikers, even tough there are less skilled, because they will not be taken down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 3, 2011 Report Share Posted September 3, 2011 I have no clue whatsoever what the ideal % is. I hit 3 from 7 at just over 10% but that could have been blind luck or super slidery or simply just random chance, I'm just trying to get figures now so rather than just scream fix it we can show Mike what is and isn't working so he can work out why Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RodrigoMachado Posted September 3, 2011 Report Share Posted September 3, 2011 As I pointed out before, I think the problem is : - aggro takedowns being as hard as ever - counter takedowns (yesterday's biggest weapon) having being nullified So no matter how aggressive or cautious you are, it's hard. Today, you got to have a quite great standup game to land takedowns, and yet it's hard (see last Jeremy Tonal fight - I'm sure his manager did'nt mess up sliders, yet his wrestling was nullified) 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 3, 2011 Report Share Posted September 3, 2011 I have no clue whatsoever what the ideal % is. I hit 3 from 7 at just over 10% but that could have been blind luck or super slidery or simply just random chance, I'm just trying to get figures now so rather than just scream fix it we can show Mike what is and isn't working so he can work out why I see your point dude... probably I'm just upset with the loss and want a change right now. Maybe we should test (fight) a little more, Mike should also make his own tests. Let's see... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 3, 2011 Report Share Posted September 3, 2011 That's why I'm gonna compile the list with aggression and td % etc, so he knows what to test to see if there's a problem. I'll ask him and see what stats he needs then see if it can't get resolved one way or another Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 Anybody having problem getting the opponent into the clinch or I am just being paranoid? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 ok decided to leave sliders like they were to try it out and now 100% counter is way to passive and doesn't always attempt to counter i did maybe 1 action out of about every 8 of his and got destroyed because of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 Anybody having problem getting the opponent into the clinch or I am just being paranoid? no i have max clinch and my speed and strength is super high too both like wonderful and i couldn't get a clinch either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 As I pointed out before, I think the problem is : - aggro takedowns being as hard as ever - counter takedowns (yesterday's biggest weapon) having being nullified So no matter how aggressive or cautious you are, it's hard. Today, you got to have a quite great standup game to land takedowns, and yet it's hard (see last Jeremy Tonal fight - I'm sure his manager did'nt mess up sliders, yet his wrestling was nullified) i disagree none of my wrestling bjj guys have had any problems with takedowns on a counter basis. aggro takedowns i can't seem to land though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 first off, I wrestled D1 in college at a top 20 school,... second I have started training Muay Thai- specifically Clinch fighting tactics mixed with Judo(as part of my daughters self defense program) - I also have been competing in several grappling competitions here in South Florida currently. I am telling you, two guys at the same weight, the shorter more powerful guy will destroy the taller guy... especially if he is that stupid 7'0" tall shit. 80% of the Clinch battle is leverage from getting under the other guy. How does your 7 foot tall guy get any leverage on a 5'9" guy of the same weight. are you kidding me? the shorter fighter has the leverage advantage in the clinch lol lol lol lol MORON! LOL.....how in the sam hell would you ever even come to figure that? a tall fighter will sling a short fighter all over the place. he'll start off by grabbing the short guy by the head (taking 100% of the leverage) and moving and twisting him any place that he pleases lol. the short fighter will have not even a degree of that leverage. it's no different than a tree. tie a rope around the base of a tree and pull it. you'll not budge it ---- tie a rope around the top of a tree and pull it. you bow it right over. it's no different when two fighters battle over leverage in the clinch. the short fighter grabs the tall fighter around the base (very little leverage) while the tall fighter grabs the short fighter around the top (where all the leverage is at lol). i mean seriously ajperok, it seems like you really do have good intentions when you talk. but when you talk you say the dumbest stuff im sorry if somebody else has already called him out on this, but im just now getting to read through the thread and im only on page 10 [edit] that's also why you see tall fighters that are damn near impossible to be taken down from the clinch. because they have SO much length to them that they can squat and spread their legs wide spreading out there base and making them that much more stable. a short fighter cant do that. it's just not physicaly possible. if you deny that it gets exponentially harder to flip something over as it gets wider, then you're just being unreasonable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajperok Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 are you kidding me? the shorter fighter has the leverage advantage in the clinch lol lol lol lol MORON! LOL.....how in the sam hell would you ever even come to figure that? a tall fighter will sling a short fighter all over the place. he'll start off by grabbing the short guy by the head (taking 100% of the leverage) and moving and twisting him any place that he pleases lol. the short fighter will have not even a degree of that leverage. it's no different than a tree. tie a rope around the base of a tree and pull it. you'll not budge it ---- tie a rope around the top of a tree and pull it. you bow it right over. it's no different when two fighters battle over leverage in the clinch. the short fighter grabs the tall fighter around the base (very little leverage) while the tall fighter grabs the short fighter around the top (where all the leverage is at lol). i mean seriously ajperok, it seems like you really do have good intentions when you talk. but when you talk you say the dumbest stuff im sorry if somebody else has already called him out on this, but im just now getting to read through the thread and im only on page 10 [edit] that's also why you see tall fighters that are damn near impossible to be taken down from the clinch. because they have SO much length to them that they can squat and spread their legs wide spreading out there base and making them that much more stable. a short fighter cant do that. it's just not physicaly possible. if you deny that it gets exponentially harder to fli p something over as it gets wider, then you're just being unreasonable I have never heard anyone so condescending, yet clueless at the same time. What are you talking from, is it experience? watching sports? or you just trying to defend another throwback to the old engine. I don't even know where to start addressing this idiocy? Start with strength and size my 5'10 220 pounder http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo91/fighting_lemur/images-5.jpg your 7'4 220 pounder http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo91/fighting_lemur/PHO-10Jun19-233077.jpg beyond the idiocy that these kind of guys actually exist, and I'm sure you've had plenty in your stable.... apparently your not understanding leverage? Have you ever been in a Clinch, have you ever gotten underhooks on someone? The whole battle is getting under the other person. Your talking about pushing the head down for knees... fine, whatever that is one type of clinch and one part of one style... not near the most effective for scoring takedowns, dirty boxing or even landing elbows. or how about a basic MMA fighting website vs the Muay Thai Clinch Taller opponent- # However, the fighter often capitalises on their opponent’s vulnerable upright position by shooting in for a takedown. fucking duh? (hardly "near impossible to take down", LOL) http://www.mixed-martial-arts-training.org/mma-fighting-techniques-the-clinch - here read about a wrestling Clinch and explain how a taller fighter has any advantage getting under his opponent? Considering just about all throws are done with a waist clinch of some sort... Not to mention lowering your center of gravity is the prime defense in takedown counter, and breaking a clinch It must piss you off that just about every suggestion I have made to the SIM over the past 18 months has been implemented while time and time again no one listens to your crap? The only advantage taller guys have in the Clinch is knees to the head... that is pretty much it. So keep talking out your ass because anyone that has ever wrestled, done Judo or even Muay Thai thinks you are a poser Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajperok Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 Actually, I have given you sources in discussions before and you always refuse to look at them.. so here advantage taller http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo91/fighting_lemur/images-1-1.jpg advantage shorter http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo91/fighting_lemur/images-2-1.jpg Next thing your going to tell me that 6'1" Randy Couture wasn't any good at clinching right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PBR Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 advantage taller http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo91/fighting_lemur/images-1-1.jpg actually page is taller than wandy ----- page and hendo are same height -- but its more their clinch styles your talking about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacky67 Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo91/fighting_lemur/images-5.jpg your 7'4 220 pounder http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo91/fighting_lemur/PHO-10Jun19-233077.jpg The only advantage taller guys have in the Clinch is knees to the head 4 serious Years training then in a MT fight the tall guy win all the times vs mike tyson . You put mike tyson picture vs a basket ball guy ,and then people think obvs mike would win cause it's mike tyson nothing to do with the tall . You forget elbows and knee to the boddy,try to elbows someone way bigger than u it's a complete waste of time . PS/about edwardsfan post i believe he talk about MT clinch and he's right ,u control the guy around his neck and you make circular move then he loose his balance . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 Yeah, in MT you whip them around from the double collar tie, so having long arms is pretty beneficial there. That being said, a 7' 220 lbs guy shouldn't be able to do much in a fight. Stefan Struve is extremely skinny and he's not even remotely close to 220 lbs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacky67 Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 Yeah, in MT you whip them around from the double collar tie, so having long arms is pretty beneficial there. That being said, a 7' 220 lbs guy shouldn't be able to do much in a fight. Stefan Struve is extremely skinny and he's not even remotely close to 220 lbs. Stefan struve prove you can be a guy with no skills and still be in the UFC . With the same skills and normal height he would have never do as well inmma . anyway now mike changed that so i don't even know why we keep talking agout the height stuff ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 I think most people are in agreement here aboit the clinch so I'm not sure why there are still arguments, the Muay Thai plum clinch relies on pushing your opponent down and upsetting his balance which makes it easier to land plus imparting more force by making them meet your knee as you strike with it The general clinch and MMA and wrestling clinch its better to be lower down which allows better leverage to turn or move your opponent whilst making it easier to pin them somewhere and control them As far as dirty boxing goes, it doesn't compare if the size difference is too great. Dirty boxing is based on smothering your opponent to tire their neck muscles whilst setting up and landing shots that are unexpected but if a 7'2 man is grappling a 5'11 man the tall guy can't get a clean shot at the head due to striking down and the small guy is reaching too far to have proper power if anything lands so its a non issue Muay Thai plum and Dirty Boxing/Greco Roman clinch are like tomatoes and bananas. Both may be fruit but they're pretty damn far apart and to compare them directly is just a waste of time 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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