Guest Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 What happened to the days where clothing companies were relevant??? What happened to the days when the biggest tournaments were sponsored by clothing and nutrition companies??? What happened to the likes of PWNAGE, Hellbent, Bushido, F.U.K.C. and BLKOUT??? Yes they are still around but they are shells of what they used to be. What happened to the mind blowing designs that we used to have??? I know there are still a few companies that are still out there that have some good designs (Xtreme PWNAGE, Kaiser, Perkele) What happened to the days where everyone knew what Happy Pills, White Gorilla and Milwaukee's Best were??? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 What happened to my car keys? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garycoffey15 Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 The whole buzz about designing has seemed to have fizzled out 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 What happened to my car keys? What happened to you leaving the game???? (Not trying to be mean.......oddly) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 The whole buzz about designing has seemed to have fizzled out Seriously...........we used to see some awesome ones, not to mention the skins that the top fighters had. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IHU Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 Because the only thing that makes money are orgs. Supps are broken.. Clothing is broken... and Gym never made money to begin with. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garycoffey15 Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 Yeah I know exactly what you mean I dont even bother with designs anymore used to always have customs for my fighters. now I just buy as cheap as I can because it gets thrown away everyday anyway once their morale drops. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j666 Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 MIFG we got some decent gear and yes, i DO care about designs...and my customs. i prefer custom clothing to skins cuz u can have more of them. i guess most don't but there's a few of us that do. what happened to hellbent? mickey sold it to battou, battou sold it and chuck sold it to sonny who is known to take "breaks" lol. all the badass designs were made by battou so once he was gone, there was no new shit...except for the golden glory shirt i did for them. some complain about money but then they complain about spending it (clothes do the same thing no matter the cost etc.)...i don't get it. supps? 1 unit = 14 day supply...'nuff said. ihu's post is right on the money but that has been discussed to death. use the search and u'l find out soon enuff. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 What happened to 3000 + managers. http://gifs.gifbin.com/320sw0sw7847.gif 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KellyM5 Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 I think it's money. Players have a lot more money now but the clothing & nutrition prices have not changed, nor has their business model. Clothing is still cheap for top quality stuff and it's all the same anyway. Even if you sell 500 a week at $25 each, you make a whopping $10k (estimate - it's even less if your buyers are sponsored with a discount) after you consider stocking fees. That is like chump change these days and hardly worth running a company for. I do it because people like my designs and want me to stay open, not for the money. Although I will admit that if you happen to get a top level org, merch pay is very good, maybe too good considering the financial situation the game is in right now. I've just lost interest in designing because the return is basically nothing. PWNAGE is no longer run by its creator, Buster Gloves. When Buster left the game, the company fell apart. My company is no longer affiliated with it. With nutrition it's the same problem, money. The market is overflowing with it, which makes creating high level supplements pretty easy which in turn puts more high level companies on the market that just get mixed in with the bunch. None of them really stand out except to us veteran players who have seen them progress. This also waters down the supp market and leaves everyone undercutting each other into oblivion. Happy Pills is my former baby but I sold it because ultimately nutrition is broke. I waited well over a year for things to change and all I heard was "we have plans to fix it", yet nothing changed. I sponsored many tournaments with this company too but got little in return from them, it's just a lose-lose situation for companies. All of the businesses are broken besides the orgs (which could use some work themselves, but they're functional at least). This is no longer a tycoon game because money is not an issue. You make loads of money and have no where to spend it. How this ever began seems a bit odd to me. Why would you keep adding in extra sources of income if you aren't going to add things to spend it on (besides a useless jet)? This is a sure fire way to inflate currency and destroy the economy, it's been a long time coming. I honestly don't see change coming until it's a complete disaster. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 MIFG what happened to hellbent? mickey sold it to battou, battou sold it and chuck sold it to sonny who is known to take "breaks" I did forget to add MIFG. Nothing against Sonny, but I want someone to run it that will consistently re-order product and return it to it's glory (sorry Sonny). I would love to buy it or at least help run it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warwynd Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 Without quoting Kelly or J-Bomb or many others who have posted above, it does seem that something drastic needs to be done with most of the other companies since they are either not profitable or they are not worth getting involved with. The game really needs more things to spend money on. Not fucking housing for fuck's sake, I pay rent in real life the last thing I need to worry about is paying my bills in the game too. If I have to worry about where my fighter lives and paying the utility bills and shit it would just get tedious. Rather what I would like to see is things to blow your money on like cars, nice houses (one time expenditures would be preferable) tattoos, hookers... whatever. I wouldn't even be opposed to paying a mortgage or rent if the money in game was there to support that. If I had to have an ongoing expense like that in addition to what I have now I would probably go broke in a month. The money is not as prevalent down at the bottom tiers as it is up where most of you guys are at. Many of you have been here for years and have oodles of cash, but I cannot even afford a private gym because of the expense... Actually that is not 100% true. I probably could afford a private gym for my fighters if I could actually get an invite to them. I cannot afford to run one because I do not make shitloads of cash. That said, the nutrition companies are already established and a new one would probably not have enough money to fund the research to get a supp worth buying. The cost of supps is affordable for me right now regardless of the level of it. I'm OK with that, but is it profitable for the nutrition company to sell it at the prices they sell for...? Seems likely but at the same time I think that the amount of money they have had to invest is pretty ridiculous and a start up company would just not be able to compete unless they were backed by enough cash to choke Mammon. Conversely Orgs can start generating profit relatively soon without having to invest truly horrendous amounts of cash. Part of that has to do with the fact that all their money comes from NPC's whereas all the other companies rely exclusively on real life people or their fighters. I also think the gym fee cap is a killer for gyms. Why would anyone run a gym if they cannot charge enough to keep the lights on? They wouldn't. So that means that except for private gyms which are consistently run at a huge loss because the managers can inject cash into them, which necessitates laundry to rip the money away from fighters, that the only way to make money with a gym is to make the gym as shitty as possible... What!?! That makes no sense In the real world, people run private gyms that professional fighters train in... and they are profitable!!! I know, shocking, right? As far as clothing goes... well perhaps they need to either have a quality trait, therefore commanding a higher price because they look cool as shit, but they also boost morale better for instance, would make them worth $300. But as it is... I would never pay that much for a shirt because I can buy a shirt from someone else for $25 and it has the exact same effect. I like MIFG clothes because they look cool as shit, but it would be even better if they gave a better bonus. That said, MIFG looked just as good as it does now, but 5th round was "higher rated" and gave better boost to morale, I would probably be buying from them more that from MIFG. In short I think the whole tycoon side of this game needs to be revisited. I may have to write up something with some of my thoughts on the matter and post it for the community to review and comment on. Perhaps a workable solution could be developed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manfred Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 For myself, I stopped doing skins because of the money. I just don't need it anymore. I was lucky enough to be a part of the Hell's Balls conglomerate and cashed in when we closed it all down. I have more than enough to fund a private gym for a couple RL years. I've been there, done that, pushed the envelope so now the only motivator is cash, which I don't need. What I don't get is why no one has filled the void left by guys like Opa and myself. Customs are really the only way to make good money in clothing. As for what needs to be done, I've talked until I'm blue in the face about the business side so I won't lay it all out here. What we do know is the top orgs are making a million dollars or more per event after the changes and the other businesses are making little b/c of market or game restrictions. Some thoughts that are not perfect but might help: - Shelve life / expiration dates for supps and maybe clothing too - Sliding scale for ordering prices on supps (2500 units of 160q costs the same as 2500 units of 100q right now) - Price floors for top quality supps - Orgs get a max of 20% of merch. Where irl would you give half of your gross sales to the event organizer? - New clothing product: Outfits which are 160x275 and have a higher max price, maybe 1k instead of 600. - Gym equipment rentals: Pylo boxes, speed bags, yoga balls, resistance trainers, ect. that could be rented for a fee and income not visible to the public 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 Hellbent was great. I don't understand how you could fuck that up either. You already have all the designs. Why get rid of all those nice designs and exchange them with crap? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warwynd Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 Some thoughts that are not perfect but might help: - Shelve life / expiration dates for supps and maybe clothing too - Sliding scale for ordering prices on supps (2500 units of 160q costs the same as 2500 units of 100q right now) - Price floors for top quality supps - Orgs get a max of 20% of merch. Where irl would you give half of your gross sales to the event organizer? - New clothing product: Outfits which are 160x275 and have a higher max price, maybe 1k instead of 600. - Gym equipment rentals: Pylo boxes, speed bags, yoga balls, resistance trainers, ect. that could be rented for a fee and income not visible to the public All of these are excellent suggestions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexiZaitev Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 Without quoting Kelly or J-Bomb or many others who have posted above, it does seem that something drastic needs to be done with most of the other companies since they are either not profitable or they are not worth getting involved with. The game really needs more things to spend money on. Not fucking housing for fuck's sake, I pay rent in real life the last thing I need to worry about is paying my bills in the game too. If I have to worry about where my fighter lives and paying the utility bills and shit it would just get tedious. Rather what I would like to see is things to blow your money on like cars, nice houses (one time expenditures would be preferable) tattoos, hookers... whatever. I wouldn't even be opposed to paying a mortgage or rent if the money in game was there to support that. If I had to have an ongoing expense like that in addition to what I have now I would probably go broke in a month. The money is not as prevalent down at the bottom tiers as it is up where most of you guys are at. Many of you have been here for years and have oodles of cash, but I cannot even afford a private gym because of the expense... Actually that is not 100% true. I probably could afford a private gym for my fighters if I could actually get an invite to them. I cannot afford to run one because I do not make shitloads of cash. That said, the nutrition companies are already established and a new one would probably not have enough money to fund the research to get a supp worth buying. The cost of supps is affordable for me right now regardless of the level of it. I'm OK with that, but is it profitable for the nutrition company to sell it at the prices they sell for...? Seems likely but at the same time I think that the amount of money they have had to invest is pretty ridiculous and a start up company would just not be able to compete unless they were backed by enough cash to choke Mammon. Conversely Orgs can start generating profit relatively soon without having to invest truly horrendous amounts of cash. Part of that has to do with the fact that all their money comes from NPC's whereas all the other companies rely exclusively on real life people or their fighters. I also think the gym fee cap is a killer for gyms. Why would anyone run a gym if they cannot charge enough to keep the lights on? They wouldn't. So that means that except for private gyms which are consistently run at a huge loss because the managers can inject cash into them, which necessitates laundry to rip the money away from fighters, that the only way to make money with a gym is to make the gym as shitty as possible... What!?! That makes no sense In the real world, people run private gyms that professional fighters train in... and they are profitable!!! I know, shocking, right? As far as clothing goes... well perhaps they need to either have a quality trait, therefore commanding a higher price because they look cool as shit, but they also boost morale better for instance, would make them worth $300. But as it is... I would never pay that much for a shirt because I can buy a shirt from someone else for $25 and it has the exact same effect. I like MIFG clothes because they look cool as shit, but it would be even better if they gave a better bonus. That said, MIFG looked just as good as it does now, but 5th round was "higher rated" and gave better boost to morale, I would probably be buying from them more that from MIFG. In short I think the whole tycoon side of this game needs to be revisited. I may have to write up something with some of my thoughts on the matter and post it for the community to review and comment on. Perhaps a workable solution could be developed. people forget that clothing and supps can also only operate on a monthly basis while orgs (take mine for example) have arenas booked through december 1st meaning everything until then is profits. the problem with clothing is that everything is rated the same, there is no difference (effect wise) between a $7 shirt or a $300 shirt. we have no 'brand' names in this game. a cotton shirt costs roughly the same amount to make but depending on the brand and design it could be anywhere from 10 bucks to 60 bucks. maybe tie in a clothing companies rank to how much morale they give back, say your fighter is sponsored by a top 5 clothing company and is wearing their gear, he gains more morale because he is wearing sponsors gear as well as it being a top clothing company. while this wouldnt directly fix the issue it could start making them at least a little relevant Edit: The cotton shirt portion was in relation to real life Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 I'll be honest, I didn't make this thread to figure out what was wrong with the game, but I am enjoying what it has turned into with the brainstorming that it has created. Hopefully Mike or one of the developers happens to read this thread and takes some of these ideas in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toejam98 Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 ALEXIIIIIIIIIIIII YESSSSSS, YESSSSSSSSSSSS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warwynd Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 people forget that clothing and supps can also only operate on a monthly basis while orgs (take mine for example) have arenas booked through december 1st meaning everything until then is profits. the problem with clothing is that everything is rated the same, there is no difference (effect wise) between a $7 shirt or a $300 shirt. we have no 'brand' names in this game. a cotton shirt costs roughly the same amount to make but depending on the brand and design it could be anywhere from 10 bucks to 60 bucks. maybe tie in a clothing companies rank to how much morale they give back, say your fighter is sponsored by a top 5 clothing company and is wearing their gear, he gains more morale because he is wearing sponsors gear as well as it being a top clothing company. while this wouldnt directly fix the issue it could start making them at least a little relevant Edit: The cotton shirt portion was in relation to real life That is exactly what I was saying about clothes. You elaborated a bit on it, but yes, that is it exactly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 What happened to you leaving the game???? (Not trying to be mean.......oddly) Due to overwhelming demand I have decided to stick around. Turns out most people here love them some CGrace so I can't abandon my fans! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manfred Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 There was discussion (long ago) to do variable quality clothing that would last longer (to make it easier to program) Check the date, lol: I've asked for this in the past. I think the best solution is different quality of fabrics that would last longer and would cost the clothing company more to order Currently 150Q items lasts 25 days (before it starts having a negative effect) and a set of 10 costs $110. Maybe you could do something along the lines of: 130Q / 15 days - 10 = $80 150Q / 25 days - 10 = $110 170Q / 35 days - 10 = $150 It makes more sense than research. RL companies don't normally do research on developing different types of fabric. They just order it at varying costs. I'm opening up a IRL clothing brand right now and I can tell you the costs do vary like that depending on they type of material. Basic tee shirts, for example, are based on material type and weight. Your average t-shirt is likely about 185 grams/m2. But you can go cheap and buy 150 grams or, go high end like me and get 220s. It costs more to me, but I won't be charging KMart prices either and don't want my new company to be associated with crappy, throw away shirts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 18, 2012 Report Share Posted July 18, 2012 I'm opening up a IRL clothing brand right now and I can tell you the costs do vary like that depending on they type of material. On a side note from all of this, make sure you give us all a link when/if you get a website up and going. I know I would love to see the designs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
haystax Posted July 18, 2012 Report Share Posted July 18, 2012 I can't speak for other designers .. but it kind of gets old. For me, I got burned out making clothing designs when I was running Prime Designs and then looking at the top clothing companies out there and seeing stuff that were straight copy/pasted from real MMA clothing companies. There were of course the epic companies up ahead of me, but there were always others that didn't do shit. I went back to running a clothing company because I decided I liked it. And I am running this one completely differently. I make minimal money ... hell, to be honest, I think I barely am over breaking even with Stonewall. I dropped my prices crazy low and don't care if I sell out week one or not all for the month. I don't really care about the 500 weeks this time either. I design a new shirt or shorts when I feel the desire to. With posters, I got way burned out on it. Doing every poster for 4 orgs eventually killed my desire to do them. Even though I was making crazy money with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KellyM5 Posted July 18, 2012 Report Share Posted July 18, 2012 I think the most important thing right now is creating a money sink that goes to NPC's, not the player. We need take a lot of money out of circulation. Orgs generate loads of money from nowhere but there is no place for this money to go besides jets and gyms which just aren't enough. As long as money continues to stockpile, we're going to see problems with the businesses. Once this is solved, then move onto fixing the businesses. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rambo Posted July 18, 2012 Report Share Posted July 18, 2012 What happened to... Syndicate Drugs S.W.A.T. LEGACY (turned into Konflikt Down Under) Synchronicity Canadian Top Team (money glitches made private gyms become public) White Gorilla Nutrition & Gym are good ones too. That's why I love the CFC. The perfect combination of old school and class. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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