Holy crap takedowns are hard!

[762x39]

When I first read that I thought it sounds like a decent idea. But the problem with it is almost every top end fighter is going to have at least elite-- takedowns or takedown D. So it will still not help the ground fighters get it to the ground. Since escapes does not help you to stop them, the only way to fix it is to lower escapes some.

 

I am adding this. Giving a bigger gap at the top end is only going to help strikers even more. Most ground guys are not going to have elite kicks, like strikers do. So with takedown/takedown d not changing, adjusting skills just makes a strikers kicks more effective.

Edited January 11, 2016 by 762x39

[Madness]

When the gaps at the bottom are similar to the gaps up top then you can properly tweak that stuff so making it fair on one end doesn't suddenly throw the other end all out of wack.

[762x39]

I can see what you are saying, I do think adjusting the skills gap would be good also. As long as the other changes went along with it. The edge in kicks, or knees and elbows would be countered my the boost to GNP and subs. So that would cross each other out, if the ground guy had a better chance to get it to the ground and keep it there.

[jeaston]

There has been an issue with takedowns in this game for a long time now.

 

I have had a sensational wrestler with elite takedowns vs a competent wrestler and get all takedowns stuffed.

 

It was explained to me that I spammed takedown so was predictable there for the other guy knew it was coming so stopped it.

 

To predictable? Sensational wrestler with elite takedowns in my opinion should get the takedown over and over and fucking over again if he wants as the other guys is only competent in wrestling.

 

I then had members tell me they could defend takedowns from Johnny Hendricks if they knew he was doing takedowns only. Predictability would allow them to stuff Johnny. I think this is bullshit.

 

Agree with this! Everybody knows DC will try to take them down. No one (Except Jones and Gus) has been able to stop him and that had more to do with length then pure wrestling ability, plus those guys fight at an elite level. At the lower levels of this game, their is no way guys with significant advantages like the one Steel explained should be able to stuff takedowns like that no matter how many times you spam them.

[rac2]

k1 tycoon at its finest

[Guest]

If only some of the guys GSP or Hughes fought could have known that their opponents would try to take them down... /sarcasm

 

I've said this before: The main problem with the engine is that it does not reward diverse attacks nearly enough. It's much better to specialize in this game than to mix things up and it's a big problem.

[MasterLeader]

In my opinion, grapplers have never been weaker than they are now.

In my opinion, graphics have never been weaker than they are now

[clydebankblitz]

 

Agree with this! Everybody knows DC will try to take them down. No one (Except Jones and Gus) has been able to stop him and that had more to do with length then pure wrestling ability, plus those guys fight at an elite level. At the lower levels of this game, their is no way guys with significant advantages like the one Steel explained should be able to stuff takedowns like that no matter how many times you spam them.

 

Well if we're talking "elites" and stuff, DC's wrestling is MUCH higher in that regard than Jones' is. Also, Gus took Jones down in their fight, and Jones took DC down in their fight. If you put things at a "If this guy is elite, he'll ragdoll sensational" then stuff like that is all nullified.

 

Plus, he wants sensational wrestling to always throw about competent wrestling...so what use is being a striker? Strikes don't ALWAYS have to have wrestling backgrounds. They can keep their distance, work the jab etc. If being a certain level of wrestling means you get the takedown literally every time, that's like saying an elite boxer should KO a competent boxer every single time.

[KingEpicity]

 

Well if we're talking "elites" and stuff, DC's wrestling is MUCH higher in that regard than Jones' is. Also, Gus took Jones down in their fight, and Jones took DC down in their fight. If you put things at a "If this guy is elite, he'll ragdoll sensational" then stuff like that is all nullified.

 

Plus, he wants sensational wrestling to always throw about competent wrestling...so what use is being a striker? Strikes don't ALWAYS have to have wrestling backgrounds. They can keep their distance, work the jab etc. If being a certain level of wrestling means you get the takedown literally every time, that's like saying an elite boxer should KO a competent boxer every single time.

 

 

Let me put it this way. With a roster full of strikers, I 100% believe the game caters to stand up fighters at the moment. If fact, winning a decision if you have a grappler vs a striker at a higher level is almost impossible at the moment if the manager with the stand up fighter knows how to set the right sliders. Subs score nothing, escapes score equal or higher than takedowns at the moment and stand up fighters can spend more than half the fight on their back and still win.

 

Ron is a good example of a grappler who has done well in this game engine but he is also 135 where grappling is the strongest. This is in comparision to say HW or SHW where grapplers are pretty much useless.

 

As for people loving yet hating the counter takedown era. It's been said many times in this thread there is never going to be a perfect system, the counter takedown era seemed to have more balance then any other and a lot of things going for it. Unfortunately it had one major flaw that was hard to ignore and continuously exploited and the fix for it upset the balance between grapplers and strikers.

There will never be a perfect era but there is no issues with talking and debating to figure out what changes the majority think could and should be made to make the game as realistic as possible. Yes this will be a never-ending process as long as the game exists and that is why we discuss it between ourselves and bring the majority verdict to Mike in an Improvements thread when the time is right.

 

There is nothing wrong with expressing your opinion on what you perceive to be negative aspects of the current game engine, it should be encouraged if anything. Of course, this is not the same thing as people like Mike Jursilla crying out in a thread because he lost a few fights to grapplers after the last change. Some people will always point fingers to the game engine when they lose but most on here(especially the vets) are level headed enough to see what works and what doesn't and make a calm assessment on what is going on.

 

As said, myself for example. I don't have any true grapplers and I think there is a lack of balance between strikers and grapplers. I have seen plenty of fights I probably should of lost.

 

With peace and love, R.E.

[Lockdown]

Another of my old grapplers got shut out hard again, Lol

 

Is there a counter-striking era going on? I've never seen so many successful counters in a row in my life. My guy missed a TON and was on like 65% accuracy too. Still the amount of counters in succession was incredible - never seen anything like that.

 

 

Mousasi swings widly with a right hand
and May counters with a nice uppercut.
Mousasi misses with a hook
and May counters with a good low kick that Mousasi was not able to check.
Mousasi misses with a hook
and May counters with a nice jab to the body that keeps Mousasi thinking.
A lazy body kick from Mousasi
and May counters with a solid body kick.
http://www.mmatycoon.com/images/fight/2.gif
That's two minutes gone in the round.
May ducks low and lands a nice hook to the body of his opponent.
Mousasi is breathing heavily.

[KingEpicity]

Another of my old grapplers got shut out hard again, Lol

 

Is there a counter-striking era going on? I've never seen so many successful counters in a row in my life. My guy missed a TON and was on like 65% accuracy too. Still the amount of counters in succession was incredible - never seen anything like that.

 

 

Mousasi swings widly with a right hand

and May counters with a nice uppercut.

Mousasi misses with a hook

and May counters with a good low kick that Mousasi was not able to check.

Mousasi misses with a hook

and May counters with a nice jab to the body that keeps Mousasi thinking.

A lazy body kick from Mousasi

and May counters with a solid body kick.

http://www.mmatycoon.com/images/fight/2.gif

That's two minutes gone in the round.

May ducks low and lands a nice hook to the body of his opponent.

Mousasi is breathing heavily.

 

 

Depends on your level of aggression, his level of counter, both of your physicals(mainly speed and agility) and energy levels. It does happen but there def isn't a counter striking era going on.

 

 

Edit: Okay your guy is 40 and has taken quite a bit of punishment and his guy is 26 with a good manager so I assume off the bat his physicals should be elite and yours have probably fallen to the sensation/exceptional level. It also looks like he was going HEAVY counter which means naturally the only shots will be landing are counters. He also landed a lot of leg kicks which zapped Mousasi's speed and made him easier to counter in rounds 2 and 3.

[Lockdown]

 

 

Depends on your level of aggression, his level of counter, both of your physicals(mainly speed and agility) and energy levels. It does happen but there def isn't a counter striking era going on.

 

 

Edit: Okay your guy is 40 and has taken quite a bit of punishment and his guy is 26 with a good manager so I assume off the bat his physicals should be elite and yours have probably fallen to the sensation/exceptional level. It also looks like he was going HEAVY counter which means naturally the only shots will be landing are counters. He also landed a lot of leg kicks which zapped Mousasi's speed and made him easier to counter in rounds 2 and 3.

 

Yeah good points, except his conditioning is still elite and his strength is still sensational. Just never seen so many successful counters like that in a row - although I've never had a roster of 40 year olds before either. Surprising I didn't get him down in the first round fresh - I guess you really don't need much wrestling skill these days just proper sliders and you can defend a grappling assault rather effectively.

[duphus]

Another of my old grapplers got shut out hard again, Lol

 

Is there a counter-striking era going on? I've never seen so many successful counters in a row in my life. My guy missed a TON and was on like 65% accuracy too. Still the amount of counters in succession was incredible - never seen anything like that.

 

 

Mousasi swings widly with a right hand

and May counters with a nice uppercut.

Mousasi misses with a hook

and May counters with a good low kick that Mousasi was not able to check.

Mousasi misses with a hook

and May counters with a nice jab to the body that keeps Mousasi thinking.

A lazy body kick from Mousasi

and May counters with a solid body kick.

http://www.mmatycoon.com/images/fight/2.gif

That's two minutes gone in the round.

May ducks low and lands a nice hook to the body of his opponent.

Mousasi is breathing heavily.

[poraan]

I have noticed that many grapplers that visit at top dont even have that good hiddens..

Legendary Dickie Dirty for example. What if he would have better chin? He still was beating all guys untill he got finished

 

Also i feel like its a lot easier to find out strikers hiddens.

 

So question is does people underestimate grapplers, because there is less grapplers than strikers. Wich makes that there isnt much grapplers with good hiddens?

If takedowns and offensive ground game would be more powerfull, how much all these guys that can grapple and strike could destroy pure strikers?

 

I count my Perälä as grappler. Hes best lw on the game and he destroyed earlier #1, even without getting single one takedown...

As long as grapplers can have striking skills i feel like its only bonus, if you have offensive grappling skils.

 

Hybrid>striker and grappler.

[markyosullivan]

I have noticed that many grapplers that visit at top dont even have that good hiddens..

Legendary Dickie Dirty for example. What if he would have better chin? He still was beating all guys untill he got finished

 

The only times Dickie Dirty has lost has been in the dieing minutes of the last round, I think if he could preserve his energy better, he wouldn't have been KO'd in both fights. Robertson has scary KO power, he's KO'd Dickie, Connemara, MSL and was both Connemara's and MSL's first KO loss. Tuomari Hurmio was lucky to avoid being KO'd the same way Dickie was, he was rocked with minutes left in the last round. Perhaps Tuomari has a bigger heart and that's why he was able to hold on, I'm not overly sure.