PBR Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 Sorry Mike, not to sound like I'm calling you out or trying to dog on you but what do you mean balance out? There is no balance what so ever in a capitalism...isn't this going to end up with everybody on the same level in due time? Free markets always balances it self out without socialist types of tactics. It's in a constant state of flux...that is balance in a free market) and that is where it was heading. Someone has to be on top though and someone has to be on the bottom....it HAS to be that way or in the end we all were the same clothes drive the same cars and really have no reason to try to be better than the next guys because the powers that be will make sure you're all equal. We spoke before about trying to help give the smaller companies a leg up and I am all for it but imo this is going to fail drastically in due time. Maybe I'm missing something and I'm not too bright but this economic socialist cap is not the answer. If you put a stop to this I'll close NSN today if it helps you borrow time to implement a viable alterative because I truly feel this will ruin the business aspect for the game in the not too distant future. in all honesty closing down isn't going to help the smaller companies -- too many companies now with 156 and above supps -- as i stated i think its an issue of them not trying and pushing their products -- if you were to look around the forums you would think there is only 6 to 7 supp companies but their is almost 100 -- kind of hard to know someone is in business if you never see them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 With all the new restrictions in place reset all the nutrition companies ratings of their products back say 30%.This would likely result in a mass exodus and is possibly the worst suggestion I've seen given ever in this game. However... I think the first mistake was made with all due respect by Mike himself when he verified non stops product being over 150+ way back in the beginning. I dont remember what led him to do that but I believe that was the beginning of the non stop monopoly.You win a prize for this one. Once Rollins advertised products at 150+, Mike stepped in to verify that he had in fact surpassed the cap of 150. It was an official declaration that NSN had the best quality supplements in the game. Previously, the big deal with supplements is that it was a gamble. You didn't know what you were getting and instead had to trust the owner. Mike completely took this off the board as an equalizer. There was no reason to buy from anyone else. NSN wasn't just claiming to be the best, Mike himself had stated it. Even with caps in place, NSN is still going to shit on everyone else. Rollins can barely even keep Recovery 159 on the shelves. It's sold over 5000 units since the change was announced. If you want to help the smaller companies, the actual product quality should be listed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MMATycoon Posted November 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 Game balance means a lot of things. Suitable reward for effort put in, suitable gains from training, a reasonable chance of success vs failure in certain circumstances. Just making sure that the game plays well for as many people as possible, whilst remaining remotely realistic. Rollins, obviously I disagree that this will ruin the company aspect of the game, so we'll have to see who's right. If you're right then we'll have to change it up again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rollins Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 Well, as far a "who will be right in the end" if I were a betting man I'd put my money on you since you know the ins and outs of the game better than anyone. I just figured I'd put in my little .02. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 If you want to help the smaller companies, the actual product quality should be listed. Along those lines, I have another suggestion - rather than listing the product quality specifically (I.E. by actual number), what about setting quality ranges, similar to the ranges of coaching quality, and displaying them? It wouldn't have to be as granular - say, 25-point ranges or so, with the top range being anything 150+. I have to agree that one of the problems I have had with giving local suppliers a shot in the past is that we have no idea what the real product quality is, and don't have the time to risk giving our fighters shitty product and mess up their training for two weeks. As soon as my guys (or myself) could afford to buy NSN's products, we did, we have since, and we will continue to do so until we KNOW there is a viable alternative locally that (no offense to White Gorilla) is not run by one of my gym's competitors. Having some indication (other than the "word" of the nutrition company owner) of what the quality is would be a big help towards that. And Rollins, while I admire your willingness to "fall on your sword", so to speak, for the sake of the smaller companies, there is no need to be a martyr. Presumably NSN did not develop into the juggernaut that it is through any unfair tactics - you just did a great job with your company, and you put out some kick-ass products. As others have said, it is through no fault of yours that others haven't succeeded. That said, if somebody in Montreal (other than White Gorilla - again, no offense intended, I just don't want to support my competition in the gym business) came out with a verifiable 150+ Recovery product, I can guarantee that I would buy there instead, because I am very much about supporting local businesses where possible, not because I have anything against you or the successful business you've built. Hell, I'd even consider it if it were in the 125+ range. Anyway, I'll stop rambling now - just wanted to add my opinion to the discussion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PBR Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 Having some indication (other than the "word" of the nutrition company owner) of what the quality is would be a big help towards that. so my word is no good? -- lol -- his supp his rated correctly as i have tried it and am also getting ready to try his new stamina --- but i do understand your true feeling on not supporting competition -- although the gym supports itself so your not really supporting it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 Again, it is nothing against Tats - he seems like a really cool guy, and I honestly have no doubts about the product ratings. I also really have no problem with the competition from his gym (or any other), and looking at his numbers it is clear that the gym is self-supporting - hell, I know that it can be done for far less. The issue is just one of perception - it simply wouldn't "look right" to me for my fighters to be using his supplements, because they are branded the same as his gym, which is one of my main competitors in Montreal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 Again, it is nothing against Tats - he seems like a really cool guy, and I honestly have no doubts about the product ratings. I also really have no problem with the competition from his gym (or any other), and looking at his numbers it is clear that the gym is self-supporting - hell, I know that it can be done for far less. The issue is just one of perception - it simply wouldn't "look right" to me for my fighters to be using his supplements, because they are branded the same as his gym, which is one of my main competitors in Montreal. *changes the company name to Purple Hippo* *waits for the cash to roll in* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 Even if Rollins were to close NSN, I'd just buy from MMA's Best. Why? Mike verified their actual quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j666 Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 Even if Rollins were to close NSN, I'd just buy from MMA's Best. Why? Mike verified their actual quality. not tryin' to start shit or anything. so a verification from mike is the only way you'll buy? jus curious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 Even if Rollins were to close NSN, I'd just buy from MMA's Best. Why? Mike verified their actual quality. I understand you're making the same point as your last post, but I could have sworn that I sent you some samples when my 158 Elite Energy came out, did you not verify it for yourself? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PBR Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 Even if Rollins were to close NSN, I'd just buy from MMA's Best. Why? Mike verified their actual quality. i think the only one tycoon actually verified was non-stops 150+ recovery and mma's best 156 recovery -- so what makes you think they couldnt make something up on the others? probably cause you have tested them is why --- thats what its about testing i try others out just to see sometimes -- i even try a lot of smaller companies stuff just to see -- proof has 151 recovery for 20 bucks, i have tested it and it works great Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 Yeah, he only verified those two, but Mike's verification of the EXACT quality meant both companies could be trusted at their word. Hulk Supplementz had their supplements listed at 147, but after Roy took over the company, he revealed they were actually slightly lower than that. I've brought stuff from Proof and a few other places out of curiosity and needing a supplement right away, but when the quality of supplements is supposed to be a guessing game and the GM basically verifies that NSN and MMA's Best are the top two companies in the game, why bother? Hell, I've seen supplement owners admit to not even using their own stuff or if they do, only until stuff from NSN or MMA's Best arrives. Never received the Silverback stuff, but I have a crapload of energy supplements as is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 I can vouch for White Gorilla, I have been without my NSN for 3 days in Montreal, and was plead with his products Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 *changes the company name to Purple Hippo* *waits for the cash to roll in* Seriously, bro - if it weren't named "White Gorilla", I would have bought it! As it is, I'm trying to encourage some other local guys to put out some higher-quality product. It won't quite be the same quality rating as yours, but it'll be a start! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 7, 2009 Report Share Posted November 7, 2009 ive read this entire thread now and personally i agree with the changes. ive been around for a long enuff time now to have noticed that when mike tycoon makes a change its usually pretty well thought out and from more than just one point of view. and whether or not i agree with a change i know at least two things are certain, 1. he knows more about it than me so he's probly right and 2. i know with out a shadow of a doubt that its ALWAYS in the best interest of the game. it may not always be the popular choice but everybody here knows that a great game is his main goal. this will add competitivenous, realism and excitement Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 7, 2009 Report Share Posted November 7, 2009 ive read this entire thread now and personally i agree with the changes. ive been around for a long enuff time now to have noticed that when mike tycoon makes a change its usually pretty well thought out and from more than just one point of view. and whether or not i agree with a change i know at least two things are certain, 1. he knows more about it than me so he's probly right and 2. i know with out a shadow of a doubt that its ALWAYS in the best interest of the game. it may not always be the popular choice but everybody here knows that a great game is his main goal. this will add competitivenous, realism and excitement Socialist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 7, 2009 Report Share Posted November 7, 2009 Socialist Yes... Aaaaaand? I find the bad connotation Americans attach to socialism extremely funny. Seriously, this is a game not real life economy. You have to be an absolute dumbo to think that an economical ideology that's any different from your American doctrine can't be more enjoyable for a game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 7, 2009 Report Share Posted November 7, 2009 bottomline, if you think your good, close shop and open a new one. its ten times as competitive now, and NSN would NEVER make it back to the top. not becos he's not a good owner, but becos the games not perfect and balanced yet. thats why changes have to be made. so everyone has an equal oppurtunity with hard work to achieve the same goals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 7, 2009 Report Share Posted November 7, 2009 bottomline, if you think your good, close shop and open a new one. its ten times as competitive now, and NSN would NEVER make it back to the top.Silly noob. Rollins could shut down NSN right now, re-open it, and put out two 159 Quality products. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 7, 2009 Report Share Posted November 7, 2009 Silly noob. Rollins could shut down NSN right now, re-open it, and put out two 159 Quality products. haha, thats funny. ive been here longer than you have! and yea ofcoarse he could with his bank account but im talkin about starting off from square one. theres only so many ppl that will actually put there on preferences aside and look at things from an unbiased stand point and make reasonable decisions, no matter how it may effect them. but most ppl try to protect there advantages while on top and fight to eliminate those advantages while on the bottom. thats all im saying. if you put yourself in each persons shoes and view things from there perspectives then you'll come up with a more well rounded solution. for now, this one i think is an improvement. yea it may need to be tweaked in the future, it may not, but as long as the intentions are good and made with fairness to everyone in mind. im all for it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rollins Posted November 7, 2009 Report Share Posted November 7, 2009 Every one of Steve's posts have the same bad vibe and miserable tone. I truly feel bad for that guy. Steve I hope you get more enjoyment out of life then what you show here. Not one of your posts have ever made me laugh or even smile, reading your posts is like walking into a party and seeing a turd in the punchbowl. Every time man, it's really depressing. This is way off topic and I don't mean any disrespect, you seem like a real smart guy but it really is a bummer reading the same old smug, depressing stuff you throw out there no matter the topic. I'll assume deep down inside you're a fine fellow but good god man you need to lighten up and learn how to have some fun. At least don't take ALL of your misery out on the MMA Tycoon forums. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 7, 2009 Report Share Posted November 7, 2009 and he's never not here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j666 Posted November 7, 2009 Report Share Posted November 7, 2009 Yeah, he only verified those two, but Mike's verification of the EXACT quality meant both companies could be trusted at their word. Hulk Supplementz had their supplements listed at 147, but after Roy took over the company, he revealed they were actually slightly lower than that. I've brought stuff from Proof and a few other places out of curiosity and needing a supplement right away, but when the quality of supplements is supposed to be a guessing game and the GM basically verifies that NSN and MMA's Best are the top two companies in the game, why bother? Hell, I've seen supplement owners admit to not even using their own stuff or if they do, only until stuff from NSN or MMA's Best arrives. Never received the Silverback stuff, but I have a crapload of energy supplements as is. that would be me, owner of combat pro formula. i've got mma's best and nsn in my sig and i use their shit cuz it's just better than mine...and i don't have energy loss yet. i know what quality my stuff is and there's is just better...no need for me to lie. i coulda listed my shit at 140+ or 150+ (which i did at first) but i changed em to what they are...141 & 153. i've also helped out quite a few companies all over just cuz i don't wanna see them go under but i'm guilty of using the stuff i'm more familiar with. as pbr stated, i don't even know of half the companies in the game but if i could, i'd help em out as much as possible. y'all need to get your company name out there man...get more active. i'm not necessarily for the change but i'm certainly not against it, as far as supps go...i just go with the flow and see where i land. i'm not that into the clothes changes tho cuz they should be separated from supps...2 completely different things. edwardsfan...that's like sayin if mcdonald's started out today, from scratch, they wouldn't be able to compete. that's fantasy world shit bro...pure speculation, in which my retort would be...i bet if everybody started from scratch, MY shop would be #1, i'd have 18 million dollars, with 10 elite-across fighters, with perfect records and my manager would be getting virtual blowjobs every hour on the hour because he'd be that damn cool. my fantasy > yours...159 > 158 no matter what way you cut it...go experiment on that one genius. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 7, 2009 Report Share Posted November 7, 2009 Jeez Rollins, I'm sorry. Maybe I get annoyed rather easily on the forum but if you think I'm miserable than maybe you are the one that needs to lighten up. Why did you have to go after me in a thread where everybody is moaning? That's a hurtful post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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