Official Nutrition Improvement Thread

[Erik]

2) Independent rating of clothing quality. Anyone can rate (and redo anytime they please), fashion doesn't belong to buyers only. A new average rating for clothing. I would like to see the good artists rewarded.

 

I do not like this as it would probably end up a lot like the forum reputation system.

[thegroovemonkey]

I'd like to reiterate my strong opposition to nutrition changes that make things much more of a hassle for everyone. Lowering nutrition length or preventing people from stockpiling supplements just creates a new chore for everyone. If there are changes, they should make things more fun and interesting for the average player.

Lowering the length doesn't add any new hassles at all. You can still buy as many supps as you want so you don't have to change them all the time.

[MadDog]

OK, 1 week of discussion, let's try and get to some sort of concensus on improvements, then we'll do the stuff people are most happy with. If you want to link to an old thread, you can do but let's keep all the info in this thread too, so also summarise your thoughts from that thread or the general ideas in the thread overall.

 

 

 

Maybe allowing Nutrition Companies to have at least 3 gym partners..

[thegroovemonkey]

I will post it again, supply needs to be decreased and demand needs to be increased... It will fix the problem long enough for other features to be implemented.

 

As far as the other ideas of extra this and that go, I'm all for it. As long as the supply/demand problem gets fixed and we expand the economy past an org only profitability system then the game can grow. I will stand by till I die that supps and clothes need to last for less time and the problem is fixed. This moves more money around which will eventually get placed into any and all money sinks. It also opens up options for new players to have a chance at getting started.

 

I would love for Mike to post the stats on failed Supp companies, becuase I know it would support my argument and show you that a lot more VIP's are lost due to the nutrition problem than are lost due to whatever other reason anyone can come up with...

[MMATycoon]

OK, I've read through everything and here are my thoughts:

 

 

Problems

1. Everyone buys from the same shops.

2. The whole industry is low profit.

 

General thoughts

- On NPC stuff. I am very hesitant to do but here is the solution I am happy with. Partner with an org for an event and depending on the attendance and your company hype, your sales are a % of the existing merchandise sales at the event. Could limit to 1 or 2 event per day perhaps, then there would be a lot of events for smaller promotions to partner with. Could do it event by event or "an official nutrition partner of X org".

 

- I would also like to start fighters mentioning their sponsor in post fight interviews if they win, with that linking to the store. I wouldn't mind giving the manager an option of a choice of post match interview speeches, e.g. hype a fight with X other fighter, say they want a new contract, thank sponsors etc.

 

- I also like the option for low level products to have the same effect as top ones, for low level fighters. Not sure exactly how that would work but as has been mentioned, basically the same system a we have now with coaches.

 

- I would quite like a price floor per the quality of the product. Helps both 1 and 2. Very simple to implement and would potentially have the biggest impact both to force a profit and create an opportunity for cheaper items. We could limit the number of products you can have on sale at one time to e.g. 6 - this would prevent the larger companies just having an expensive product and a cheap product.

 

- I would like expiry dates on products but I don't think that solves either problem 1 or 2. It does ensure a steadier flow of sales but does that really matter that much?

 

- I would like to increase shipping times. Would probably help problem 1 a bit but not that much. Very easy to implement.

 

- Decreasing the length of time that supps last is OK but wouldn't solve the undercutting on prices.

[Guest]

 

 

General thoughts

- On NPC stuff. I am very hesitant to do but here is the solution I am happy with. Partner with an org for an event and depending on the attendance and your company hype, your sales are a % of the existing merchandise sales at the event. Could limit to 1 or 2 event per day perhaps, then there would be a lot of events for smaller promotions to partner with. Could do it event by event or "an official nutrition partner of X org".

 

 

This would work pretty well.

 

- I would also like to start fighters mentioning their sponsor in post fight interviews if they win, with that linking to the store. I wouldn't mind giving the manager an option of a choice of post match interview speeches, e.g. hype a fight with X other fighter, say they want a new contract, thank sponsors etc.

 

While cool and all I just don't think enough people read other fighter's PBP's or care what supplement/shirts their opponents are using. I know that I stopped paying attention to the sponsor mentions in the ToTT at about fight 2 when I relaized that clothing and org companies have about 0% contribution to fighter edge (because clothing is meaningless and nutrition supps are about equal for all fighters)

 

- I also like the option for low level products to have the same effect as top ones, for low level fighters. Not sure exactly how that would work but as has been mentioned, basically the same system a we have now with coaches.

If it worked the same as coaching/sparring etc it would be awesome.

 

 

 

- I would quite like a price floor per the quality of the product. Helps both 1 and 2. Very simple to implement and would potentially have the biggest impact both to force a profit and create an opportunity for cheaper items. We could limit the number of products you can have on sale at one time to e.g. 6 - this would prevent the larger companies just having an expensive product and a cheap product.

Unless you also add new supps you will just see companies with Cheap Energy Loss supplement and an Expensive Energy Loss supplement.

 

- I would like expiry dates on products but I don't think that solves either problem 1 or 2. It does ensure a steadier flow of sales but does that really matter that much?

 

Coupled with the sales cap this would actually force consumption from more companies as the companies would actually run out of product.

 

- I would like to increase shipping times. Would probably help problem 1 a bit but not that much. Very easy to implement.

 

- Decreasing the length of time that supps last is OK but wouldn't solve the undercutting on prices.

 

True, but again, since there is a sales cap it forces overflow demand into new channels.

 

 

 

Comments emphasized.

[Guest]

General thoughts

- On NPC stuff. I am very hesitant to do but here is the solution I am happy with. Partner with an org for an event and depending on the attendance and your company hype, your sales are a % of the existing merchandise sales at the event. Could limit to 1 or 2 event per day perhaps, then there would be a lot of events for smaller promotions to partner with. Could do it event by event or "an official nutrition partner of X org".

 

i didnt figure you'd be up for the too much of the NPC stuff. cant say that i blame you. might as well try to keep it as close to 100% user contolled interaction as possible. that's one of this games selling points.

 

i like this idea of partnering though. i've always thought that it should work if you have fighters on the card then you get sales based off of that. and if they win, put on a good performance, are exciting, etc. you would get more sales. but that would probly be too complicated. your idea is much simpler and actually a lot better.

 

 

- I would also like to start fighters mentioning their sponsor in post fight interviews if they win, with that linking to the store. I wouldn't mind giving the manager an option of a choice of post match interview speeches, e.g. hype a fight with X other fighter, say they want a new contract, thank sponsors etc.

 

im really amazed by this. when it seems like everybody else is centered in on a few improvements and got everything figured out, then you post something that's way outside of the box and has everybody saying "awesome! why couldnt i think of that?". if i had to throw my thoughts in on it i'd say that each thing you choose would have to have effect. for instance if you shout out that you want a new contract and you dont get it, then you're morale should drop. same for hyping another fight and not getting it. the thanking sponsor thing would be something that would need to be worked out in negotiations. you might not get sponsored again if you forget to make that shameless plug lol

[Guest]

While cool and all I just don't think enough people read other fighter's PBP's or care what supplement/shirts their opponents are using. I know that I stopped paying attention to the sponsor mentions in the ToTT at about fight 2 when I relaized that clothing and org companies have about 0% contribution to fighter edge (because clothing is meaningless and nutrition supps are about equal for all fighters)

im assuming that mike means that if you plug a sponsor after the fight then it generates more sales for them? although, now that i think about it, im not sure when they'd get the sales? if they arent sponsoring the event you plug them on then how would they get any benefit from it?

[Guest]

I can only assume he means one of two things, either that anyone that reads the pbp will see the interview and so the company gets free publicity potentially leading to more sales

 

Or he is going to introduce 'public sales' which would give a boost to sales based on the hype generated at the event mimicking the audience then going to the store thanks to the plug

 

The second one, though difficult to perfect, would be fantastic as it then leads to hype and sponsorship being a useful tool and business strategy

[Guest]

I can only assume he means one of two things, either that anyone that reads the pbp will see the interview and so the company gets free publicity potentially leading to more sales

 

Or he is going to introduce 'public sales' which would give a boost to sales based on the hype generated at the event mimicking the audience then going to the store thanks to the plug

 

The second one, though difficult to perfect, would be fantastic as it then leads to hype and sponsorship being a useful tool and business strategy

yea i have to agree. it may be in the works so that when a fighter plugs a company that is actually sponsoring that specific event gets more "public sales" than if it's just any ordinary event. that would kinda drive companies to sponsor local fighters to ensure that they are sponsoring events that will likely have the most of their OWN sponsored fighters on it. in turn earning them maximum profit

[Guest]

I can only assume he means one of two things, either that anyone that reads the pbp will see the interview and so the company gets free publicity potentially leading to more sales

 

Or he is going to introduce 'public sales' which would give a boost to sales based on the hype generated at the event mimicking the audience then going to the store thanks to the plug

 

The second one, though difficult to perfect, would be fantastic as it then leads to hype and sponsorship being a useful tool and business strategy

 

 

Since he did not say the second I was assuming the first which would have little or no impact whatsoever. Implementing the second would be great because it would also force a lot more post fight interviews.

[MMATycoon]

I wouldn't want it to just magically create sales but it could increase the company's hype, which in turn would mean more sales when they partnered on another event. If they were partnered on the event the fighter was fighting on, maybe they get an extra boost.

[thegroovemonkey]

OK, I've read through everything and here are my thoughts:

 

 

Problems

1. Everyone buys from the same shops.

2. The whole industry is low profit.

 

General thoughts

.- I also like the option for low level products to have the same effect as top ones, for low level fighters. Not sure exactly how that would work but as has been mentioned, basically the same system a we have now with coaches.

 

- I would quite like a price floor per the quality of the product. Helps both 1 and 2. Very simple to implement and would potentially have the biggest impact both to force a profit and create an opportunity for cheaper items. We could limit the number of products you can have on sale at one time to e.g. 6 - this would prevent the larger companies just having an expensive product and a cheap product.

 

It helps #2 by making supplements have to cost more, it doesn't help #1. I'm just going to make a supplement at the top of different price floors and charge the minimum for it to garner more money for myself

 

 

- I would like expiry dates on products but I don't think that solves either problem 1 or 2. It does ensure a steadier flow of sales but does that really matter that much?

 

 

Steady cash flow is the name of the game, if more people have to buy supps I guess that's better, the same should be done to clothing though if you do this, since they are even more fucked since their donation products work just the same as the real thing.

 

 

- I would like to increase shipping times. Would probably help problem 1 a bit but not that much. Very easy to implement.

 

Might help keep business local a bit more, but I don't know what kind of difference that would make. More local buyers and fewer buyers from other cities will probably wind up being close to even.

 

- Decreasing the length of time that supps last is OK but wouldn't solve the undercutting on prices.

Has to be done to some degree, or problem #1 hasn't been addressed at all. The reason for undercutting is do to oversupply and no demand. 2 companies can supply most cities and none of these suggestions address that. Order cap also needs to be lowered in conjunction with supps lasting less to raise supply.

 

As the owner of two huge nutrition companies I think these changes could me me a lot more money, but I don't think they will do much to help out the new guys if supply/demand stays at it's current level.

[Krimzn]

So how about making it so that if you reach a certain level of hype, your quality minimums increase?

 

Hype Value

0-75 = 130Q - 137Q

75-120 = 137Q - 145Q

120-180 = 145Q - 157Q

180+ = 157Q - 165Q

 

Fighters that use products within their hype range should receive the maximum boost to whatever supplement they're currently using.

 

If 0 to 75 = 100% then 130Q to 137Q = 100%.

Thus if Hype = 37.5 (50%), then they will get the maximum boost if they use a 133Q or 134Q supplement. They can use a 145Q supplement, but the gains won't be as great because they wouldn't be within range. The further out of range you go, the smaller boost you will receive and if it's too distant, you might even see a negative return.

 

Something like that lol. These figures are just examples. They were just used to show the idea. Apologies if this has been suggested prior to, but I didn't really run through the whole thread. Just thought of it and decided to throw in my two cents.

[Guest]

I doubt the shipping time thing would do anything other than increase stockpiling without expiration dates to backstop it.

 

I know damn well I would not shop locally and get a crap supplement just to shave 4 days of shipping off. I would simply order massive quantities of the good stuff and never worry about the shipping again.

[DaBest]

If we lower the amount in which you can order then there wouldn't be very many new companies that could even come close to the 500 sales per week, hell some of the established ones wouldn't be able to meet the 500 sales per week. So I guess my question would be "is there even a purpose for the 500 sales per week at this point" or would we lower the sale per week as well? (For those looking to earn trophy's for sales)

[simonmoon]

- I would like expiry dates on products but I don't think that solves either problem 1 or 2. It does ensure a steadier flow of sales but does that really matter that much?

 

- I would like to increase shipping times. Would probably help problem 1 a bit but not that much. Very easy to implement.

 

- Decreasing the length of time that supps last is OK but wouldn't solve the undercutting on prices.

 

This is quite simply a supply and demand problem. I undercut prices to drive sales as the increased number of 160 quality supps drastically increased supply. That means the two ways to bring prices back up are lowering supply and increasing demand. If you lower supply, demand goes up, but profits stay low because you reduce capacity to meet demand.

 

Making supps expire will increase demand, and I support that change.

 

Price floors just forces me to make even less money because I can't respond to market conditions. I'll be glued to the bottom of the floor, and will still lose sales. Longer shipping times will just cost me even more sales. Making lower level supps as effective as high level supps for lower level fighters just further will lower demand. So these changes are going to lower demand, not increase it, just making the problem worse.

[thegroovemonkey]

This is quite simply a supply and demand problem. I undercut prices to drive sales as the increased number of 160 quality supps drastically increased supply. That means the two ways to bring prices back up are lowering supply and increasing demand. If you lower supply, demand goes up, but profits stay low because you reduce capacity to meet demand.

 

Making supps expire will increase demand, and I support that change.

 

Price floors just forces me to make even less money because I can't respond to market conditions. I'll be glued to the bottom of the floor, and will still lose sales. Longer shipping times will just cost me even more sales. Making lower level supps as effective as high level supps for lower level fighters just further will lower demand. So these changes are going to lower demand, not increase it, just making the problem worse.

 

Way more supply being greater than demand is what is causing the problem, everything else is a result of that. No matter what is done, if supps last for the same length and the order cap is not decreased, 2-3 companies are all that any city needs to supply an entire fighter population.

 

Fellas, Nutrition owners like Simonmoon and I know what we are talking about. Milwaukee's Best Nutrition isn't where it is by accident...

[DaBest]

So after reading some of the stuff here I have come to a conclusion that maybe this could be added.

 

- I see there are a lot of complaints about people buying from just a select few companies. However people do this because they know they can trust those companies. (I'm the same way most of the time, only because I have purchased products that were complete fakes)

 

* So to fix this issue why don't you just implement what the product really truely is beside it? Like hey it's a 158.85765 put 158.86 beside the name of the product so people know what they are truely purchasing. That would solve part of the problem.

[kkw1998]

Maybe a focus supplement or like something that help you train to increase improvemnent of fighter faster

[Erik]

Way more supply being greater than demand is what is causing the problem, everything else is a result of that. No matter what is done, if supps last for the same length and the order cap is not decreased, 2-3 companies are all that any city needs to supply an entire fighter population.

 

The fact is that halving supp length will just result in more supp companies popping up, it's not like they really take any serious intelligence to run from the perspective of selling supps at this point (Gym and org partnerships, sponsorships etc are a different ballgame) and it's not hard to find the funds to research a 160 these days.

[thegroovemonkey]

As much as I love making 75k a week from merchandise, it pumps way to much money into the game.

[XtremeT13]

Since I haven't had a chance to really view this thread from start to finish...this may have been suggested, but I'll throw it out there anyway. Maybe we need to come up with new supplements that can allow managers to start new companies and create new supplements that aren't in the market by already established companies. I mean, we have nutrition to prevent energy loss, increase stamina and strength. Why not have some that boost speed, balance, flexibility... When it comes to training, you can specifically train to increase stamina and strength and yoga is intended on flexibility and some speed/balance I think. This would allow an addition to speed training, balance training and have yoga specifically for flexibility. Then stand up fighters could train more specific to their needed physical and ground fighters could do the same. All around fighters would be able to utalize all these as well and rely more on general ct training to maintain physicals and then stand up and ground fighters would use the specific CT coaches more than the general. This could create more options for managers, business owners (nutrition and gym) and fighters...which could lead to more differences in these areas as well.

[atlarge]

New Supplements I'd like to see:

 

Healing: Reduce Injury time. Consider it the cost of access to a good physiotherapist, massage therapist and doctor. Should be more expensive than the avg supplement. Should not affect cuts.

 

Fight Recovery: I have guys with 15++ Conditioning who are still taking 12 sessions to recover from putting on an exciting fight. Guys like Ben Henderson and Frank Edgar are able to be back in the gym after a weekend off. GSP goes back to training THE NEXT DAY if he's noticed a flaw he needs to work on. I'm not asking for something that ridiculous, but something to boost fight recovery by maybe half at the 160 level would be great. We're losing months of training time recovering from fights over the long haul, and in a time accelerated game like this, it's the equivalent of years.

 

Would also vote for weight loss/gain being used with other supps BUT maybe a cap should be put on how much weight a fighter can gain/lose based on his body type/height.

 

A Supp for overall CT would be nice too.

[billybumnut]

I'd really like to see an increase in number of gym relationships available. I can't see any reason why this would be limited to 2, particularly as there are always gyms requiring relationships.