Possible idea for VIPs without companies

[MMATycoon]

Sure, PM me in the game and I'll sort it for you in a day or so - heading off to bed now - knackered!

[Guest]

It goes a little further than that: “dude you haven't even reached the Clydesdale stage of the Anheiser Bush Marketing Plan, and DFC isn't quite the UFC yet, but together, we are going places. I even made it a requirement to own Boondock Fightwear if you are DFC.” That’s extremely mild and thankfully there’s a limit as to the number of events that can be held.

 

 

 

I disagree strongly with Cross-Bred being a better value even at this point in time, but let’s just assume they are. There are some diminishing returns with Gladiator with the bloated size there, sure. But what's the tipping point for the ratios? Neither of us knows for certain; it's spelled out vaguely in the user guide to add some mystery and challenge. The point I was attempting to make is what's happening: The active managers that are with Gladiator will largely stay there, again, from the status quo bias. The double hit for an enrollment fee is unintentionally playing right into this. He only has six coaches, but he can afford almost ten elite coaches, effectively making the value unbeatable. If that happens, what somewhat new manager is going to leave Gladiator and their sparring schedules and lay down $300 dollars to enroll with Cross-Bred? Although a limit on the number of coaches will largely squash any potential problems.

 

 

For your info, Boon is my boy, we talk on the phone even, so quit crying. He makes my posters, made my logo and my thumbnail, is that a crime? Yes, the WARWAGON is close, and we help each other out, does that make us a cartel, cause I buy clothes that someone put a lot of time into, or supplements that actually DO SOMETHING. I'm sorry if you don't like people to be friends, but we are, so not much else to say here

[EvilScott]

Yeah, I got VIP but its tricky to start a company with so may established ones already so I'm just sticking to the fightin'.

[fightking]

For your info, Boon is my boy, we talk on the phone even, so quit crying. He makes my posters, made my logo and my thumbnail, is that a crime? Yes, the WARWAGON is close, and we help each other out, does that make us a cartel, cause I buy clothes that someone put a lot of time into, or supplements that actually DO SOMETHING. I'm sorry if you don't like people to be friends, but we are, so not much else to say here

 

 

 

You don’t have anything else to say, but I have a few things to clarify:

 

The headline is ‘Possible Idea for VIPs Without Companies’. It was somewhat off topic, but I was supporting effectively capping the size the companies can get so there doesn’t have to be an alternative once the game goes public. I think that’d be the easiest thing to do and would entice more people to purchase a VIP account. I don’t know how to write code and am not going to tell anyone how to run their game though, so I’m completely dropping the topic after this is posted.

 

 

Like I’ve already said, I wasn't trying to come off as attacking any companies, just pointing out potential problems that could come up in the future and limit the games potential. Much like real world economies, virtual economies aren't immune to economic failures. It’s much easier to correct a lot of these issues with virtual economies, naturally. It just so happens that behaviors by consumers and firms play out in games like they do in the real world. I’m only aware of this because I’m a political-economy graduate student and there have been a number of studies on the topic. As to why they'd waste precious time doing so, well, that's beyond me.

 

 

Is it a cartel? It certainly has the makings of one. That’s if you go by mainstream economic definitions, of course. If you don’t, that’s perfectly fine; it doesn’t make what I said any less true though. I did actually say that what you guys had going on was extremely mild and probably wouldn’t develop given certain restrictions already in the game, if you’ll recall. You seemingly don’t recall that though.

 

 

Do you honestly think that I really care who you’re friends with or chat it up with on the phone? Do you truly think I’m against friendship? I’ll state for the record that I don’t care who you interact with and am pro-friendship. Probably a big shock to you, I know. Those were idiotic things to assert and a poor usage of straw man tactics. You’re acting like as big of a dick as the boobs in your avatar. Lastly, I don't know why you emphasized that the supplements your taking work. If that's a cheap way of knocking mine, I'll gladly give you some free to show you that they work better than what you can buy elsewhere for the same price.

 

[Rollins]

Are you serious? ....a real cartel? Say it isn't so...

[Guest]

http://www.megapunk.co.uk/forum3/images/smilies/bond.gif

[WhisperingDeath]

Are you serious? ....a real cartel? Say it isn't so...

If we're a cartel we should go all Pablo Escobar on these guys. Where is the in-game option to put a bomb on the CFC president's airplane?

[sathias]

How about a small bonus to training for that VIP's fighters? Instead of the manager putting his energy into a company, he puts it into helping his fighters train. Or would that make the already complex training functions even worse

[MMATycoon]

That wouldn't be hard but I don't want the VIPs to have a competitive advantage in that overt a way.... I know they get an advantage by having more money from e.g. more fighters and companies and that gives them an advantage but giving them more of a bonus from training is a step too far - it's just one step under making them win more fights.

[BlackCornel]

How would you work the media company in terms of what the company owner would do to make them a better media organization than any of the others?

 

let them bring a newsletter, to promote a tournament, fighter, company.

[MMATycoon]

Well as we were thinking of making like a site news letter or whatever, I was thinking about how to possibly combine the two. Will definitely do it if it can be done.

[shortstack]

How would you work the media company in terms of what the company owner would do to make them a better media organization than any of the others?

 

 

Physical Therapy companies might be a good option. If your fighter sustains a 14 day injury, and you send him to a top notch physical therapy session, his injury time might be reduced a couple days, and if you use a recovery supplement and go to physical therapy perhaps you could get rid of the injury all together.

[redos]

I deffently think we should do somthing about people who just randomly open gyms with a bunch of elite and other good trainers, and then they have real cheap training fee's like there just in it to kill themselfs and take evryone with them.

Sure there is the remove vip thing to punnish those people but the thing is they will last long enough to hurt any serieus bussines.

 

 

[shortstack]

I deffently think we should do somthing about people who just randomly open gyms with a bunch of elite and other good trainers, and then they have real cheap training fee's like there just in it to kill themselfs and take evryone with them.

Sure there is the remove vip thing to punnish those people but the thing is they will last long enough to hurt any serieus bussines.

 

 

And that brings up the other point. If the point of the VIP is to bring cash into the game to fund the servers and such, then why are we so quick to remove VIP accounts when people run their businesses into the ground. I obviously think there needs to be a severe punishment if you run your business into the ground, but taking away a VIP account just seems like it's a recipe for less money to support the game. I know a lot of people right now are or will be in jeopardy of losing their VIP accounts due to the number of poor businesses being run out there. Perhaps instead of pulling somebody's VIP account, the punishment should be to ban them from running businesses. That's the way it would work in the real world. If you run a business into the ground your credit score takes a huge hit and you may never be able to get a loan for a business again.

 

The problem with new gyms opening with all elite trainers at low prices will be a problem, particularly in markets where there are already too many gyms. The easy fix to this is to lower the amount of the initial loan (From 50,000 to 20,000), so that it is not possible for a new gym to hire elite trainers unless they use their own funds. You could add in down payments for new businesses. So let's say you want a 20,000 loan to start a gym. Well the bank is going to make you put down a $10,000 downpayment of your own funds to show that you are financially capable of running a business and to make sure you have some skin in the game.

 

Bottom line:

1. Lower overall loan amounts for businesses; and

2. Require downpayments to start a business; or

3. Remove the loan option all together and force people to save money to buy a business.

 

[MMATycoon]

There's a big thread somewhere about why it doesnt work just to not let them lose their company but I couldnt find it. Basically it would mean they could start a company, bleed it dry of the full loan by sponsoring their fighters then just let it go under. They might not have event wanted a company in the first place and can basically get a free $50k.

 

I'm thinking about just halving their VIP though rather than stripping it all together.

 

In terms of more constraints on what coaches you can hire, I'm going to do that. I'll make sure the gym has enough funds to support their coaches when they hire them.

[shortstack]

There's a big thread somewhere about why it doesnt work just to not let them lose their company but I couldnt find it. Basically it would mean they could start a company, bleed it dry of the full loan by sponsoring their fighters then just let it go under. They might not have event wanted a company in the first place and can basically get a free $50k.

 

I'm thinking about just halving their VIP though rather than stripping it all together.

 

In terms of more constraints on what coaches you can hire, I'm going to do that. I'll make sure the gym has enough funds to support their coaches when they hire them.

 

Well when you do that, also consider that gyms sometimes need to hire new coaches to attract new membership, so give them "some" leeway at least to hire better coaches to increase membership. I think you could simply end all the problems though by limiting the amount of loan that a person can apply for. 50,000 seems to be a bit much. If you start them with 20,000 instead for a gym, then they might be able to hire 3 elite coaches, but it sure won't last very long!

[MMATycoon]

Limiting the loan wouldnt stop someone hiring a coach they couldnt afford, it would just mean that when they did hire a coach they couldn't afford, they'd go bankrupt more quickly.

 

edit - this is the thread that talks about the issue in detail http://www.mmatycoon.com/forums/index.php?...pic=571&hl=

[Patti]

I deffently think we should do somthing about people who just randomly open gyms with a bunch of elite and other good trainers, and then they have real cheap training fee's like there just in it to kill themselfs and take evryone with them.

Sure there is the remove vip thing to punnish those people but the thing is they will last long enough to hurt any serieus bussines.

 

 

Yeah. Another thing is, not only will they last long enough, but when they're gone someone else will come along pretty soon. People cannot learn from the mistakes of those before them when they weren't here to witness the mistakes. Someone who's been on the site for less than a week cannot know about the gyms that opened the exact same way they did and had to close two weeks before they signed up on this site.

 

If this has actually happened, I'm too new to know about it. But I can easily imagine when the site is public, and big, that the gyms could look like:

One opens, takes a few weeks to go bankrupt, and falls. Someone new joins the site after that, (has no idea what just happened), opens a gym, goes bankrupt, over and over. Meanwhile they bring everyone around them down.

 

And, you can't totally blame them for opening like that. When there are gyms around already, you can't just be better than Cozad. There's pressure to have something on the other gyms, and some (all?) cities are not filling up fast enough for the fighter/trainer ratio to be a problem, and hardly anyone is letting their equipment get gross.

 

 

There's a big thread somewhere about why it doesnt work just to not let them lose their company but I couldnt find it. Basically it would mean they could start a company, bleed it dry of the full loan by sponsoring their fighters then just let it go under. They might not have event wanted a company in the first place and can basically get a free $50k.

 

I'm thinking about just halving their VIP though rather than stripping it all together.

 

In terms of more constraints on what coaches you can hire, I'm going to do that. I'll make sure the gym has enough funds to support their coaches when they hire them.

 

 

Will the old gyms have to follow that with the coaches they already have? Otherwise I can't really imagine starting a gym now. Although I guess it could only be a problem for another month or so, until the ones who can't afford their coaches fail. But waiting a few weeks or months also doesn't help the people around now who could afford their coaches if new elite gyms hadn't opened up around them already. They may fail, too, since the problem already exists. Either they can't attract enough people or they feel pressured to overdo it, too, to get people.

 

[MMATycoon]

Astute observation about the potential repetitive nature of the gym failures Patti. What I was planning on doing is just limiting the option for hiring a new coach, which wouldnt help the ones who are destined to fail already but would catch future failures.

[KyleNumbers]

This IS a game... A simulation that is supposed to be open. I think the coaching idea is a good one but let's take care to not make this so linear.

[Guest]

 

 

 

all I know is that if nothing happens, when this shit hits sherdog, I will be happy as fuck I started early, and had a chance to establish DFC, cause there will be 3000 ORGS in Vegas over night

 

 

Thanks again Mike

[MMATycoon]

If there are 3000 orgs overnight then that means 3000 VIP signups in one day, which would make me very happy

 

But yeah, I will implement some sort of system so that that can't happen, don't worry!

[bottle2k]

Perhaps the idea may be to limit the number resources within a particular company. For instance, how many elite coaches could there be in any given area? Also, if they know of their lofty status, they'd request more for their services. This also lends itself to the seminar idea, and further down the line, retired fighters becoming trainers. Then by having a finite number of trainers (of all types)- you limit the amount of gyms being able to be open. If you make the number of trainers dependent on the number of fighters in an area, new gyms will open when needed.

 

As far as ad agencies are concerned, what if you treated them like gyms? For example, have those agencies hire ad people. They could be rated in certain categories like- t.v., print, radio, live events, and the like. Depending on which media outlet you choose, you get a boost to hype ratings, which can eventually trickle down to the fighters.

 

Of course, programming all this would be a beast, but hey, if we're knocking arouind ideas.....

 

 

 

 

[Guest]

brand new ORGS have a fighter cap, that way they are forced to put on more shows to hire more fighters