Guest Posted July 19, 2009 Report Share Posted July 19, 2009 Takedown and submission spammers sure are annoying. They shoot for an incredibly large amount of takedowns (sometimes over 100!). This has to be stopped. So I have a solution to the takedown pollution. Knees Think about it. When they shoot for a takedown, they aim for the torso. This leaves their head rather exposed. If the guy shooting for the takedown ends up getting kneed in the face, the results could be devastating. Now, you may be wondering if this is implemented, what will happen to sprawling? A slider could be used to determine whether you want to sprawl or use your knees. Now let's weight the pros and cons of sprawling and kneeing Sprawl Pro: Harder to take down Con: Less damage Knee Pro: More damage Con: Easier to take down Comments? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dushira Posted July 19, 2009 Report Share Posted July 19, 2009 Not a bad idea, I like it. Knees would be linked to muay thai and sprawls to wrestling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HBK Posted July 19, 2009 Report Share Posted July 19, 2009 I think by doing this Muay thai will be overpowered...can strike and KO/Defend takedowns? giving them an individual slider will be too much... Maybe it should depends on intelligence... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 19, 2009 Report Share Posted July 19, 2009 Takedown Defense could cover sprawls and knees could govern...well knees. The intelligence part is a good idea, I just like the control that sliders give. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duxwig Posted July 19, 2009 Report Share Posted July 19, 2009 I'd have no problem with this. MT seems underutilized already, seems like a good reason for it to be used more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danehoy12 Posted July 19, 2009 Report Share Posted July 19, 2009 WHy not focus on defense. Stay on your feet and, if you go down, have the defense to not lose. If that is the case, you should be able to KO them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Posted July 19, 2009 Report Share Posted July 19, 2009 I agree in general that there are way, way too many takedown and sub attempts. There needs to be some price paid, I think, for trying those moves almost exclusively. I'd love to see a few fights stopped cuz a guy ate somebody's knee in a takedown attempt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 19, 2009 Report Share Posted July 19, 2009 WHy not focus on defense. Stay on your feet and, if you go down, have the defense to not lose. If that is the case, you should be able to KO them. On paper, it's the perfect solution. In practice, however, they just keep shooting and they eventually get the takedown. With the knees idea, they could get knocked out from constantly shooting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 19, 2009 Report Share Posted July 19, 2009 I'd like to see anyone who unsuccessfully fails to take down their opponent more than 9 times in a single round get automatically rocked by an uppercut, hook, or knee when attempting the 10th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 19, 2009 Report Share Posted July 19, 2009 I'd like to see anyone who unsuccessfully fails to take down their opponent more than 9 times in a single round get automatically rocked by an uppercut, hook, or knee when attempting the 10th. im not a spammer and have faced spammers b4 also but if u change the rules to stop every tactic that somebody might try eventually u have everyone with the same slider set up. if someone tries one thing to many times then they get ko'd automatically then eventually they will start putting there sliders in the middle like everyone else so then what? would there even need to be sliders? u mite as well put the fighters up against one another and just see who's got the highest skill ratings. thats basicly what it would amount to. i agree the possibility should be there for a flying knee cos it does happen in real life when someone is tellographing takedowns. but i say no to a slider for it and no to an automatic system. but if implemented in the right way it could be a good improvement i think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 19, 2009 Report Share Posted July 19, 2009 im not a spammer and have faced spammers b4 also but if u change the rules to stop every tactic that somebody might try eventually u have everyone with the same slider set up. if someone tries one thing to many times then they get ko'd automatically then eventually they will start putting there sliders in the middle like everyone else so then what? would there even need to be sliders? u mite as well put the fighters up against one another and just see who's got the highest skill ratings. thats basicly what it would amount to. i agree the possibility should be there for a flying knee cos it does happen in real life when someone is tellographing takedowns. but i say no to a slider for it and no to an automatic system. but if implemented in the right way it could be a good improvement i think I still think it should have sliders or else people will say that their fighter sprawled when they should have used their knee, they zigged when they should have zagged, and everything in between. I will agree that the automatic system seems unfair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 19, 2009 Report Share Posted July 19, 2009 I like this idea it could be the better you are with knees the more takedowns you could stop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 19, 2009 Report Share Posted July 19, 2009 I like the idea. To me an exciting fight is one where the fighters are on there feet trading blows someone get's rocked and then it goes to the ground for awhile. I find it boring to read/watch fighterXXX shoots for a take down constantly. Perhaps include some relation to the natural KO power and intelligence hidden trait. If a fighter has both and someone tries to take them down with a shoot. Have a vicious knee or punch to the face knock them the f* out. As long as said fighter has a high enough skill in punches/knees. As for the one shooting... I'm not sure you can do much to avoid taking a straight on blow when you're in a position of face first with hands to either side. Maybe speed/quickness. If you move incredibly fast, that could counter the potential for a blow to land as the opponent would have less time to react. Or maybe something like this is already in the game and there are to few of us with the required skills to see it happen. In which case, maybe the requirements could be lowered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 20, 2009 Report Share Posted July 20, 2009 I took a proactive approach to curbing this as a fight org owner. For me, it's frustrating because generally speaking, fights between 2 spammers have low ratings, which gives my card a lower rating. What i did is send a mass email to all the managers i contract with explaining this. I also introduced a KO of the night bonus (no submission bonus though), this will hopefully encourage people to put those sliders a little more towards the middle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 20, 2009 Report Share Posted July 20, 2009 I took a proactive approach to curbing this as a fight org owner. For me, it's frustrating because generally speaking, fights between 2 spammers have low ratings, which gives my card a lower rating. What i did is send a mass email to all the managers i contract with explaining this. I also introduced a KO of the night bonus (no submission bonus though), this will hopefully encourage people to put those sliders a little more towards the middle. I'm glad that some org owners are trying to stop this. Still, it would be awesone to see a few knockouts from botched takedown attempts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danehoy12 Posted July 20, 2009 Report Share Posted July 20, 2009 Mike had shown some results about a month and a half ago. They were roughly 33% per ending (that is around 1/3 sub, 1/3 KO, 1/3 decision). If that is accurate still, that is essentially what the UFC sports. Do you know how cool that is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeepis Posted July 20, 2009 Report Share Posted July 20, 2009 Mike had shown some results about a month and a half ago. They were roughly 33% per ending (that is around 1/3 sub, 1/3 KO, 1/3 decision). If that is accurate still, that is essentially what the UFC sports. Do you know how cool that is? And everyone's whining that submission specialists are overpowered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JKstar Posted July 20, 2009 Report Share Posted July 20, 2009 I have seen fights end already with someone shooting for a takedown and getting knee'd in the face. I don't think we need a slider just for it. I'd like to see more of an adjustment made to the loss of energy with failed takedowns. If a fighter has attempted 100 takedowns he should be dead, nobody has that good of conditioning. Also it's already stated that if you try too many takedowns it's easier for your opponent to stop them because it's predictable, i'd like to see more impact of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeepis Posted July 20, 2009 Report Share Posted July 20, 2009 I have an idea for a slider: Rhythm It would control whether your fighter keeps a certain rhythm, which makes him more fluent with his attack but also more predictable, easier to time, or if he randomizes his rhythm, making his attacks less accurate or weaker, because he's not in the rhythm, but also harder to time. Would rock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 20, 2009 Report Share Posted July 20, 2009 Mike had shown some results about a month and a half ago. They were roughly 33% per ending (that is around 1/3 sub, 1/3 KO, 1/3 decision). If that is accurate still, that is essentially what the UFC sports. Do you know how cool that is?No, there were definitely more wins by submission. A lot people try to get away with white belts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danehoy12 Posted July 20, 2009 Report Share Posted July 20, 2009 Non QFC fight stats Total number of fights: 2267 Fights ending by KO: 798 (35.2%) Fights ending by Sub: 1019 (44.9%) Fights ending by Decision: 450 (19.9%) Fights ending as Draws: 16 (0.7%) So there are more submission wins, but it looks like it is the decisions that are low, not the KOs. What is really needed is more of a fatigue factor so a fight goes to decisions. KOs don't need to be added at all, otherwise you are just going to see 44% KOs. 35% subs, and people bitching there are too many KOs. See how that works? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rambo Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 I'd like to see anyone who unsuccessfully fails to take down their opponent more than 9 times in a single round get automatically rocked by an uppercut, hook, or knee when attempting the 10th. Afuckinmen AMEN amen brother kudos or whatever else you say to that. you could have a slider that says...... sprawl/strike and under it a slider that says... punches/knees and if you're slider is 100% sprawl then you don't gotta worry bout if you wanna punch/knee/kick when they shoot. But I really wish the takedown spammers got KTFO after 20 takedowns of consecutively missing. (10th in 1 round is a great 1 too.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makrilli Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 I'd say the biggest problem is the lack of fatigue. People getting takedowns and knockout's even when completely gassed. Well I'm not sure if they even get gassed from shooting for takedowns. I too hate matches with onedimensional brown belts and avoid taking them to my pretty fresh organization (Hugsy in Tokyo. wink, wink). They need to be punished Whether it's the increased fatigue or striking. I also rarely see any counter strikes against takedowns but a lot counter takedowns against strikes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 I don't think we need a(nother) counter to takedowns, I think the frequency of takedown attempts needs to be cut by a factor of 10. I believe that, right now, if you set your fighter to Try Takedowns 100%, he makes something like 100 attempts in a single round. That is beyond ridiculous. Clay Guida wouldn't be able to do that. I think if your tactics slider is set to Try Takedowns 100%, your fighter should get 10 attempts in a 5-minute round. Against Thiago Alves, Georges St. Pierre attempted a total of 10 shots and 2 takedowns from the clinch over 5 rounds. Against Diego Sanchez, Clay Guida attempted 5 shots and 2 takedowns from the clinch over 3 rounds. Against Melvin Guillard, Gleison Tibau attempted 4 shots and 10 takedowns from the clinch over 3 rounds. Against Nate Diaz, Joe Stevenson attempted 5 shots and 9 takedowns from the clinch over 3 rounds. Against Cheick Kongo, Cain Velasquez attempted 2 shots and 8 takedowns from the clinch over 3 rounds. I could go on, but I'm convinced it will only be more of the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 24, 2009 Report Share Posted July 24, 2009 How about limiting the fighter to two a minute? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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