barney Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 MOST are/were drug addicts. Shit even 51% qualifies as most. That doesn't change anything. People aren't systematically homeless in America. If that makes sense. They are not oppressed into homelessness in the ways that you are in most countries w/ poverty issues. We aint accepting just cause you say so. Do you have any data? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwad12345 Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 Well, any data is more usefull than no-data. I just pointed the most recent official one. I AM open to debate. Thats what the dialetic method is all about. I say A and back it up. You say B and back it up. We end with a synthesis idea of C. They just have to be backed up tho. Im pretty much sure Brazil has drugs, mental illness and heartbreaks (kid you not, lots of 25-45 man [temp?] at the street because marriage is over) as top 3 causes... But official data says otherwise Sure, quantitative data is important but so is qualitative reasoning. Can you see how it could be in the interest of government to under-report drug use? This is getting to political territory. And can you not see how individuals would want to not admit their drug use? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rambo Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 I don't remember one single time in history where the people had a social media platform to express themselves. Just about every single person in our society can record and upload. Your point is invalid in America. Maybe it applies in 3rd world countries like Brazil lol, not here. Btw tell me what right we are getting back? What right are we fighting for? Stop police brutality? Most likely 99% of cop interactions w/ people in America go smoothly. A very, very, very small % of interactions go haywire. I see where this homeless discussion veered. Somebody was triggered I called Brazil a 3rd world country in jest. My Bad. In comparison to America, Brazil's poverty is 3rd world imo. Maybe I'm wrong. I don't live in Brazil but I've seen plenty of healthy homeless Americans. Plenty of obese homeless people. Got any of those in the jungle? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barney Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 Sure, quantitative data is important but so is qualitative reasoning. Can you see how it could be in the interest of government to under-report drug use? This is getting to political territory. And can you not see how individuals would want to not admit their drug use? Yes I can. My masters degree was going to be about testosterone abuse epidemics and under-report due to social stigma is an issue as well. We were going to use snowball + urn method to collect data, similar to used with drug abuse epidemiology studies. I did a little review about this. Before changing city and my masters went to the fridge for a while I can see all this. But as I said, when there is under-report, there are sources about it as well. All I am saying is back it up with a source. A shady .org non-profit organization stating this would be enough to keep things going. Thats it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barney Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 Like this. See that wasnt hard. Just back what you are saying with a source. This way we can see if what you are claiming does match or doesnt match real world data based on facts, not "cause me said so".A little bit of academics is not being a snob prick, is actually taking you seriously enough to ask for an intelligent discussion. Im just taking you both seriously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rambo Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 Statistics statistics... Stats reveal that every UFC champ that was Brazilian (exception, Aldo? Spilled urine anybody...) has tested positive for steroids or PEDs. Anderson Silva, Wanderlei, Belfort, Machida, Cyborg, Werdum... Statistics reveal only small % of NFL athletes test positive for steroids or banned substances... I could tell you that the majority of them use, but I have no proof (could probably dig and find article lol) it's just kind of one of those things, we'll agree to disagree. I've seen American poverty first hand. I've seen poverty in Jamaica, Mexico, Haiti, Honduras, Belize first hand... imo the poverty levels aren't comparable. I've seen American homeless, I've seen non-American homeless. I've seen documentaries on south american poverty, African poverty (west point, liberia), Asian poverty, poverty in the middle east... It's different. It seems VERY different. I'd say Americans got it made in comparison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barney Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 It appears my good will to take some guys more seriously and expect a more rationale based discussion was too much 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barney Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 Statistics statistics... Stats reveal that every UFC champ that was Brazilian (exception, Aldo? Spilled urine anybody...) has tested positive for steroids or PEDs. Anderson Silva, Wanderlei, Belfort, Machida, Cyborg, Werdum... Statistics reveal only small % of NFL athletes test positive for steroids or banned substances... I could tell you that the majority of them use, but I have no proof (could probably dig and find article lol) it's just kind of one of those things, we'll agree to disagree. I've seen American poverty first hand. I've seen poverty in Jamaica, Mexico, Haiti, Honduras, Belize first hand... imo the poverty levels aren't comparable. I've seen American homeless, I've seen non-American homeless. I've seen documentaries on south american poverty, African poverty (west point, liberia), Asian poverty, poverty in the middle east... It's different. It seems VERY different. I'd say Americans got it made in comparison. you are attempting to frame me with a McNamara fallacy. The problem is i'm not basing SOLELY on statistics. Im just asking for SOME statistics to guide the dialectical process of the discussion. Not JUST statistics. SOME. May not even be a statistic, just any source at all. Hence why your scarecrow/ad hominem fallacy doesnt add up. I tried squeezing this, but I'm now positive you are not able to go down this road 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwad12345 Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 Like this. See that wasnt hard. Just back what you are saying with a source. This way we can see if what you are claiming does match or doesnt match real world data based on facts, not "cause me said so". A little bit of academics is not being a snob prick, is actually taking you seriously enough to ask for an intelligent discussion. Im just taking you both seriously. You both? Am I one of these both? I'm not even in this debate, I just made one very simple and self evident point. In our last "debate" you at one point compared American statistics to those in the developing world, you even mentioned Turkmenistan statistics iirc. Was that being serious? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barney Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 You both? Am I one of these both? I'm not even in this debate, I just made one very simple and self evident point. In our last "debate" you at one point compared American statistics to those in the developing world, you even mentioned Turkmenistan statistics iirc. Was that being serious Not MY fault USA (offical gov data) about food security sucks. But as I said, if that data was biased and a sham, shouldnt be hard to find another one. 5min or research, tops EDIT: sucks as in relative to a country with a 20trillion dollars GDP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barney Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 Can you see how it could be in the interest of government to under-report drug use? This is getting to political territory. And can you not see how individuals would want to not admit their drug use? Inflating drug abuse/misuse data could justify gov military actions inside strategic countries, like Mexico, Bolivia, Venezuela... THe "WAR ON DRUGZZZ!" See, it can go either way. Without source back up and some kind of method, this is just a "we cant trust anything, its all subjective, there is no objective palpable truth, existence is suffering" nietszche-kantish bullshit. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwad12345 Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 Not MY fault USA (offical gov data) about food security sucks. But as I said, if that data was biased and a sham, shouldnt be hard to find another one. 5min or research, tops EDIT: sucks as in relative to a country with a 20trillion dollars GDP The point is, you should be qualifying the data you provide, along with its limitations as you post them. Comparing practically any government collected data between developed and developing countries is absurd in principle. That''s just the most extreme example. Again, I haven't been following this argument, just randomly saw and wanted to qualify one point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwad12345 Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 Inflanting drug abuse/misuse data could justify gov military actions inside strategic countries, like Mexico, Bolivia, Venezuela... Ops, didnt a private american militia just got caught at Venezuela? See, it can go either way. Without source back up and some kind of method, this is just a "we cant trust anything, its all subjective, there is no objective palpable truth, existence is suffering" nietszche-kantish bullshit. You know the data was gathered at the municipal level, right? This is a ridiculous point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barney Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 You know the data was gathered at the municipal level, right? This is a ridiculous point. Got any other? Its an open debate. Even still after 10 pages of "ridiculous point", that was the only argument with any kind of source backing it up... If its such a blatant cherry pick/survivorship bias/gerrymandering fallacy, it shouldnt take more than 3 lines of reasonable arguments and 5 min to find any source to back it up... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwad12345 Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 Got any other? Its an open debate. Got any other what? Or did you not follow what I was trying to say? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rambo Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 you are attempting to frame me with a McNamara fallacy. The problem is i'm not basing SOLELY on statistics. Im just asking for SOME statistics to guide the dialectical process of the discussion. Not JUST statistics. SOME. May not even be a statistic, just any source at all. Hence why your scarecrow/ad hominem fallacy doesnt add up. I tried squeezing this, but I'm now positive you are not able to go down this road I was only here to vent. I'm not trying to write a college thesis paper w/ references citing all my sources about American homelessness, drug addiction, and poverty. I'm not doing a research paper before responding. I'm basing things off what I see, my perspective, the homeless that I've personally encountered or known, etc. It doesn't matter if you agree w/ it or not. I could tell you most Brazilian champs in UFC has popped for juice, but don't feel like looking for an article or stats to support it. Are you asking me to provide proof to backup my comment that most of the homeless in America are or were drug addicts? Or that American homeless not as bad as other countries? Believe it or not, idc. I'm not asking you to believe me nor agree w/ me. When talking to people, I'm more interested in what they've seen or personally experienced, than the info or sources they can cite. If you want to have a battle of research papers on a subject matter like this, yes, it's clear I am not that guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barney Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 I like you dawg dont want to drag it any further Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gonzasco Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 So we give homeless people guns is what ya'll are saying? I like where this is going 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barney Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 So we give homeless people guns is what ya'll are saying? I like where this is going This IS one of my fav moves TBH 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gonzasco Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 This IS one of my fav moves TBH Wtf did I just watch? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barney Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 Wtf did I just watch? DO watch the full movie. Its GOLD 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monsieur.Camara Posted June 3, 2020 Report Share Posted June 3, 2020 I went to watc that movie in the theaters lol , my GF wanted to kill me at the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mannetosen Posted June 4, 2020 Report Share Posted June 4, 2020 So we give homeless people guns is what ya'll are saying? I like where this is going Yeah, and then we fly them out to Turkmenistan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barney Posted June 4, 2020 Report Share Posted June 4, 2020 At least they will have more access to quality food Yeah, and then we fly them out to Turkmenistan. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwad12345 Posted June 4, 2020 Report Share Posted June 4, 2020 At least they will have more access to quality food Turkmen food is very good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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