Clinch issues

[rac2]

if anything, they should be easier... clinch nowadays are a 'slighter' version of takedowns, which shouldn't really be the case imho.

[lotos]

Suggestions for Clinch: The clinch is the worst aspect of the game and needs attention.

 

knees and/or elbows get a bump, but clinching becomes harder to instigate (possibly easier to break clinch to balance the points factor). Maybe less points just for clinching. They either have to do some knees or elbows and the opponent can break clinch to even the points out. I think the clinching/break clinch point system could be adjusted to even up the overall clinch aspects. I think it being harder to clinch and giving the weapons more power would make the game a little more strategical for/against the clinch guys.

That way if I guy uses that clinch/break clinch tactic he can a)be punished by someone with elbows or knees and b)the opponent can simply counter (in points) by breaking clinch. I think maybe slightly easier to break clinch and a quite a bit harder to clinch up (and easier to get a counter from the failed clinch attempts).

 

My vote is:

 

knees- higher damage (with a little more accuracy)

elbows- higher accuracy (with a little more damage)

clinch attempt- harder (countering clinch attempts easier)-

break clinch- easier

 

Extras:

 

COUNTERING AND CONTROL: make countering in the clinch easier against guys that set sliders to high aggression.

SCORING: less points for clinching

 

Question: what does the stall and control really do? Is one more anticipating looking for a counter and the other is simply resting? Cos stall seems like an aspect that could be looked at in terms of fine tuning either the countering or negating dirty boxing?

[Revheat]

Should clinching and breaking clinches score you points on judges card? I was recently beat by a fighter that did nothing but clinch and then break his own clinch... he only landed 5 of 7 strikes the whole fight and still pulled off a decision. He did however land 13 of his 33 clinch attempts. My fighter took no damage and was not rocked or knocked down. His fighter was cut.

[lotos]

Should clinching and breaking clinches score you points on judges card? I was recently beat by a fighter that did nothing but clinch and then break his own clinch... he only landed 5 of 7 strikes the whole fight and still pulled off a decision. He did however land 13 of his 33 clinch attempts. My fighter took no damage and was not rocked or knocked down. His fighter was cut.

Should they or do they? The answer is yes they do (clinch and break clinch both add up on the scorecards)....question we are asking is what would improve the clinch aspects of the game?

[mmagladiators]

Suggestions for Clinch: The clinch is the worst aspect of the game and needs attention.

 

knees and/or elbows get a bump, but clinching becomes harder to instigate (possibly easier to break clinch to balance the points factor). Maybe less points just for clinching. They either have to do some knees or elbows and the opponent can break clinch to even the points out. I think the clinching/break clinch point system could be adjusted to even up the overall clinch aspects. I think it being harder to clinch and giving the weapons more power would make the game a little more strategical for/against the clinch guys.

That way if I guy uses that clinch/break clinch tactic he can a)be punished by someone with elbows or knees and b)the opponent can simply counter (in points) by breaking clinch. I think maybe slightly easier to break clinch and a quite a bit harder to clinch up (and easier to get a counter from the failed clinch attempts).

 

My vote is:

 

knees- higher damage (with a little more accuracy)

elbows- higher accuracy (with a little more damage)

clinch attempt- harder (countering clinch attempts easier)-

break clinch- easier

 

Extras:

 

COUNTERING AND CONTROL: make countering in the clinch easier against guys that set sliders to high aggression.

SCORING: less points for clinching

 

Question: what does the stall and control really do? Is one more anticipating looking for a counter and the other is simply resting? Cos stall seems like an aspect that could be looked at in terms of fine tuning either the countering or negating dirty boxing?

agreed, they need to make this less of a clinch rape feast.

[lotos]

agreed, they need to make this less of a clinch rape feast.

Damn straight...and it's boring too.

[Revheat]

Should they or do they? The answer is yes they do (clinch and break clinch both add up on the scorecards)....question we are asking is what would improve the clinch aspects of the game?

I think they should either score on a clinch or breaking a clinch initiated by an opponent. Not both sides of your own clinch. My opponent was simply clinching and then breaking the clinch right away.

[lotos]

I think they should either score on a clinch or breaking a clinch initiated by an opponent. Not both sides of your own clinch. My opponent was simply clinching and then breaking the clinch right away.

Yeh, see that alone doesn't deserve points as far as I'm concerned.

 

Idea: maybe if no points were given to the one who instigates the clinch, only the one who breaks it. To further that, make the MT guy (or one with better clinch) the one who can negate break clinch easier, punish the one who instigated the clinch and getting an edge on the pointing (against a dirty boxer with low MT or wrestling).

 

Or: instead of giving points for clinch/break clinch maybe it could just get harder to break clinch and/or the one with the inferior MT gets a sap of energy....so essentially a boxer can clinch up a MT guy at his own risk of losing more energy if he can't break quickly/easily? So, no points for clinching or break clinching: just an energy sap.

 

Crazy wild: we invent escapes for clinch? (just joking).... Personally we could easily solve this by making knees need more accurate, elbows little more damage, make it harder to break clinch and have energy the cost, not losing/gaining points unless you connect with clinch weapons (causing a more damage than just punches).

[Tev]

I agree

[shockg]

I am not sure how I stumbled across this fight, but is a highlight of a big problem in the clinch.

 

http://www.mmatycoon.com/fightcommentary.php?FTID=899703

 

So, this isn't an abnormal fight. A shorter guy vs a bigger guy. The short guy decides to clinch and hit body > head. The taller guy does almost exactly the same ratio

and hits head > body.

 

The shorter guy was spamming clinch, so he obviously believes he has an advantage there, his clinch and mt skills are pretty good (at least 15-- mt). It didn't work out so well. This is the problem, and it has to do with one strike. I don't care who wins the fight, but a short guy spamming at the body of an opponent who he purposefully initiated clinch with should not have a 5/42 body shot count while clinched.

 

IRL a shorter guy in the same division is going to have almost no problem hitting a very high (way way more than 50) percentage of those body shots. IRL, they don't always do a ton of damage on the average, but they can also decide fights from attrition. I'm sure everyone knows that headshots in the clinch are far easier to hit than body if both fighters have relatively equal skill in this game. I'm sure many managers know that height and weight play a factors. This showcases a flaw in the clinch engine that allows a tall fighter to hit more body shots with relatively equal aggression, while a shorter fighter (who shouldn't be missing much clinched with a significantly taller opponent) misses a massive percentage of body shots. Even if someone knew his exact sliders he shouldn't be missing that many shots. It isnt realistic that (the opponent) misses a massive percentage of body shots. Even if one knew and the didn't know exact sliders, that fighter shouldn't be missing that many shots. It isn't realistic, the defending fighter would easily break clinch if the aggressive guy leaned back that far to avoid body shots.

 

Would love for someone to check out some other fights and toss some extra fights in, I'm too lazy to look around for the next couple nights, but I won't be so busy soon. I do know from experience that in real life no semi competent fighter, (even untrained), misses that many body shots while clinching a taller guy. Maybe up accuracy and drop damage in clinch commensurately?

 

Or make clinch raping based far more on height/weight and primaries . Instead of just strength and being trained up in a private on clinchwork.

[JakeF]

I have noticed that generally body punches have lower land rate than head punches, both at stand up and in clinch. Started using a lot less, no matter if I am with the taller/shorter fighter.

[Rambo]

I have noticed that generally body punches have lower land rate than head punches, both at stand up and in clinch. Started using a lot less, no matter if I am with the taller/shorter fighter.

 

don't fight at HW

[Warwynd]

Accuracy with knees to the head are fine, damage to knees to the head should increase. Knees to the body/legs need accuracy improved. Elbows are fine.

I pretty much agree with this

[northwestguy]

elbows on a clinch build are savage ive made a lot of succesful fighters like this after getting owned by one

[Rambo]

elbows on a clinch build are savage ive made a lot of succesful fighters like this after getting owned by one

Better be quiet before your builds get nerfed lol.

 

There are gonna be a lot of salty tears come the inevitable next engine change related to clinch striking...

[Odin1713]

ive noticed muay thai is losing its ability my top level guys cant grab a lvl 2 in muay thai

[Odin1713]

and my guy got koed in the clinch by a guy who had a 4 and my guy has a 12 in mt

[Jo]

Sound good just doing this for points

[barney]

How did I lose this first round (entirely clinch)?
http://mmatycoon.com/fightcommentary.php?FTID=990602

The way I read it, I had more control on the clinch and landed more strikes.
Did he actually scored points just because spammed a lot of missing blows? Cause thats kinda shitty

[imcool]

How did I lose this first round (entirely clinch)?

http://mmatycoon.com/fightcommentary.php?FTID=990602

 

The way I read it, I had more control on the clinch and landed more strikes.

Did he actually scored points just because spammed a lot of missing blows? Cause thats kinda shitty

 

Ye was a lot more aggressive, that's why you lost the round. Strikes landed were 7 to 5, but he tripled the attempts.

[barney]

Still, he waa more aggressive losing the position (I pinned him more against the cage, yadda yadda yadda).

Its weird that being more aggressive even tho you miss and have no control of the clinch awards you more points

But thanks for the heads up

[JakeF]

I think by now everybody knows that going with less than 100 aggro in the clinch is a suicide

[barney]

I think by now everybody knows that going with less than 100 aggro in the clinch is a suicide

I was away for 6 years, coming back now. Trying to figure out how to make stalling work, its a gimmick thing I like

[Bwang]

I think by now everybody knows that going with less than 100 aggro in the clinch is a suicide

I’ve never gone 100 agg in clinch, in my entire tycoon career.

[JakeF]

I was away for 6 years, coming back now. Trying to figure out how to make stalling work, its a gimmick thing I like

 

Clinch game has always been strike spamming, anything else is ineffective. At least for the time I have been playing.

 

Oh, and there are no positions in the clinch. Any pbp text related to clinch positions is just flavor text.