Clinch issues

[minark]

In each area,more people voted stating they want no change,if the people who want a change cannot agree on what it should be and the lion share 30+% say dont change anything then what would you do? Not change anything. It was inconclusive, thats all the vote proved,we all disagree. We Just have to get all our clinchwork skill up and forget this and deal with something else. I Apologize JLP because i was with you on this but the vote destroyed your idea

 

Still wrong. More people didn't vote they don't want change. Roughly 64-65% want changes and voted yes. Change is still the majority of the vote. The fact that we can't decide on what change needs made does not kill the idea. As far as what would I do? If I was Mike, I'd be the game owner and make the ultimate decision. Mike needs to make the final decision on what changes and what doesn't, or even if he wants to change it at all. I'm happy he asked for our input but we were undecided and that's where he needs to decide as the owner of the game where he wants it to go and what he wants to do. Swing vote if you want to call it that.

[Scooby]

Lmao and after all that... its STILL*Bruce Buffer voice* inconclusive what he should do

[minark]

As far as what would I do? If I was Mike, I'd be the game owner and make the ultimate decision. Mike needs to make the final decision on what changes and what doesn't, or even if he wants to change it at all. I'm happy he asked for our input but we were undecided and that's where he needs to decide as the owner of the game where he wants it to go and what he wants to do. Swing vote if you want to call it that.

 

Lmao and after all that... its STILL*Bruce Buffer voice* inconclusive what he should do

 

That whole part answered that. Decide for himself, it's his game. Conclusively he should make the decision as the owner. Do you understand yet?

[Scooby]

It is mikes game, you are right, but people make a thread complaining about all kinds of stuff in the game daily. He obviously doesnt want to just make some changes that everyone might dislike because then he will have an overload of threads about the changes to be made once more... Understand?

[minark]

It is mikes game, you are right, but people make a thread complaining about all kinds of stuff in the game daily. He obviously doesnt want to just make some changes that everyone might dislike because then he will have an overload of threads about the changes to be made once more... Understand?

 

Lol, that's completely unrelated to your argument that the majority voted no. This is your way of saying Mike will get shit for changing things. Completely different.

 

And if he chooses not to do anything that's fine. It's his choice and he'll just continue to deal with the shit storms of "game engine broken" threads everyone posts. Now you've completely turned the subject from what votes were winning to "oh poor Mike taking shit for game changes." Still doesn't disprove any of my previous posts or which side of the vote was the majority.

[Scooby]

This shit is pointless dude, my point was that in EACH category 1/3rd of the people who decided to comment said "neither needs a bump" or "No for both" if the rest is inconclusive... which it is... Instead of fumbling with this, we should probably deal with one of the other issues that all these members are crying about if IT is more concise on what the change should be. EXAMPLE, in the TWGC Thread, people voiced an issue, found an answer, and mike told us the changes he will make, simple.... if you want to keep with this conversation, go ahead. Its pretty clear that the vote gave us no clear cut answer

[JLP]

I think the results were skewed because the majority of managers who thought nothing should be done were relatively new managers who have yet to experience the clinch at a high level. Early on in the game any single facet of the fight can look overpowered when the opponent dwarfs your skill in that area. Thats why clinch rape and subspamming are so effective early on. So I think I can understand where a newer manager would see the clinch as very powerful, when in reality it is easily the least effective of the three facets of the game.

 

I advocate a bump to getting into the clinch and a bump to getting out of it. Although I wanted to have elbows and knees bumped a bit at first, now my thinking is maybe that is something that Mike could look into later after we see how effective clinch becomes after Mike does a little tinkering.

 

I also like the ideas Mannetoeson has advocated, but they do seem a bit more complicated to implement, so maybe it's something that can be rehashed at a later date.

[Mystery]

http://www.mmatycoon.com/fightcommentary.php?FTID=655341

 

I got clinched 10 times, twice per round, clinch is more than easy enough to get.

[JLP]

http://www.mmatycoon.com/fightcommentary.php?FTID=655341

 

I got clinched 10 times, twice per round, clinch is more than easy enough to get.

twice per round sounds about right, maybe should be a little higher. especially in a K-1 fight when no time was spent on the ground.

Having CK kick your ass must have really hurt your feelings after that fight.

[Mystery]

twice per round sounds about right, maybe should be a little higher. especially in a K-1 fight when no time was spent on the ground.

Having CK kick your ass must have really hurt your feelings after that fight.

 

Nah I didn't even want the fight tbh, knew he had the better fighter with a little more skills. I had a small chance of winning. The owner wanted me to move down a division and take the fight, as he already destroyed everyone else I guess, and with such a big hype difference I took a gamble and lost as usually happens when you gamble especially with my luck.

 

 

I'm sure JLP even you knows the biggest thing with clinch that is broke that no one is mentioning here from me skimming over the thread I'm sure you'd never mention it as you clearly have an agenda, and are far from fair, as is usually the case in any most any thread I see you posting in. It's the fact that a fighters weight plays way too big of a part in breaking the clinch.

 

You can have twice the strength of another fighter and equal skills and still have an incredibly hard time breaking the clinch with just a few pounds of weight difference, not sure on exact numbers but it's not that high. It becomes impossible at some point that's also not that high, I have been in a few fights where it was impossible to escape the clinch.

 

You think Cain is afraid of Mir and can't break a clinch against him?

 

Let's bring it down a level, was Machida frighten to death of getting clinched all the time, and this was known as the way to beat him? other than maybe Jones not at all, who also definitely had not only a weight and size advantage but without a doubt a big strength advantage.

 

Ok let's bring it down even farther to even lighter weights, was Frankie Edgar's weakness at LW known to be clinch where he got there and couldn't escape because he weighed a little less?

 

If someone tried to argue any of these things people would wonder if they were joking and they'd likely be ridiculed bad.

[JLP]

 

I'm sure JLP even you knows the biggest thing with clinch that is broke that no one is mentioning here from me skimming over the thread I'm sure you'd never mention it as you clearly have an agenda, and are far from fair, as is usually the case in any most any thread I see you posting in. It's the fact that a fighters weight plays way too big of a part in breaking the clinch.

 

Never noticed the weight issue. I usually have my fighters come in about 3-4 lbs over the divisions weight limit, so I'm usually the lighter fighter.

Please tell me about my agenda and all the other agendas you have noticed me posting about previously. I'm really curious about what my agenda is. More than likely you are just talking out of your ass, so seeing what you come up with has caught my interest.

[Guest]

Well I'll find out in a couple of hours with Richard vs Kato

 

What do you think of this fight?

 

http://www.mmatycoon.com/fightcommentary.php?FTID=659393

[Scooby]

I think that depends on the level of the fighters,i used a 235lb guy to clinch rape Aaron's SHW tournament and barely ever had anyone break a clinch against me,but it was 25YO creation and skills were limited

[Violentpoet]

I would like to see a real fight where the fighter only uses clinching and elbow. Redonculous

[Violentpoet]

Just disregard my prev post, I was feeling butthurt for getting hugged and elbowed to death:) 50+ elbows, hell I would've liked to see a fight like that

[Timmy]

Question 1: Yes to both, more dynamic in and out of clinch.

Question 2: I put no to both, but I would like knee to head specifically -acc/+dam.

Question 3: I put no to both, but I would like a plus to cuts for elbows (compared to punches).

[skull]

From my experience, if the fighters are fairly evenly matched then its not all that hard to get in and out of the clinch, but there are a lot of things involved in how it all works out. Like trying to reach out and clinch too much compared to counter clinching and aggressiveness has a lot to do with it as well. How your opponent has his agg/counter slider set is a factor too. All in all i think the clinch settings are fine though, only thing i could see making it better would be to have a damage/accuracy slider

[Erik]

Question 1: Yes to both, more dynamic in and out of clinch.

Question 2: I put no to both, but I would like knee to head specifically -acc/+dam.

Question 3: I put no to both, but I would like a plus to cuts for elbows (compared to punches).

 

There is already a plus to cuts for elbows relative to punches.

[Timmy]

 

There is already a plus to cuts for elbows relative to punches.

 

I once said somewhere that elbows cut more than punches but a bunch of people said I was wrong. Moral of the story is never listen to anyone on here lol.

[Stu_Pidasol]

http://mmatycoon.com/fightcommentary.php?FTID=679197

 

With a skill advantage clinch works great...

 

Take the last fight out - Lester is my only clinch fighter and his landing % are fine inside the clinch... So really disagree that the accuracy of clinch strikes need a bump...

[fenixink]

Yeah and stick positions etc. Great idea mate. The Thai plum should be harder to get for a wrestler/boxer but mt makes the difference whereas over/under or single collar favours the boxer and wrestler

 

This idea seems good, would make sense to scale double underhooks off wrestling, single collar tie off boxing, thai plum off muay thai, and for lack of judo maybe over/under is effected by bjj.

[Rasmus]

It should be based on real life fighting basis not by asking polls of the peoples. It should be based on reallife combat statistics.

[Nikita]

Да да да

[BruceLeroyWyane]

It should be based on real life fighting basis not by asking polls of the peoples. It should be based on reallife combat statistics.

 

The problem is, there are no real life statistics that can tell you how competent/Proficient/Strong/Elite etc. a person is in any given category. My guess, is that this plays a HUGE part in the engine..

 

Also, I don't think clinchwork stats have been kept track of for very long and it would only be stats for the UFC and maybe another top org so it wouldn't be an accurate representation of an entire MMA world with newbs and elites like the one in MMA Tycoon..

[Rasmus]

 

The problem is, there are no real life statistics that can tell you how competent/Proficient/Strong/Elite etc. a person is in any given category. My guess, is that this plays a HUGE part in the engine..

 

Also, I don't think clinchwork stats have been kept track of for very long and it would only be stats for the UFC and maybe another top org so it wouldn't be an accurate representation of an entire MMA world with newbs and elites like the one in MMA Tycoon..

By real life i mean the real world fighting thing. e.g Like in reality, elbows and kness are more vicious than punches and kicks, which are more damaging than even with somewhat less force, but due to low range it can mainly be implemented on close contacts. So in the game upto maximum possibility it should be based on such type of real life things. you can't make it like, a good boxer knocks out everyperson in a game and say its just a game and here boxing has more priority.

and im not trying to draw the real life statistics of a person in the game. The game structure or engine, whatever, will take care of it . Im just tryng to make a point on how the game should keep things on real life possiblities and that you cant alter it by what it is not but to question the same if its not happening. And iam just presenting an idea that how it should be and everything is on the way, the game engine works.