a note to mike tycoon

[Rambo]

Bas Rutten: 28-4-1

Fedor: 33-4 - still fighting - 35 years old

Anderson Silva: 31-4 - still fighting - 36 years old and arguably at the peak of his career

Matt Hughes: 45-9 - still fighting - 38 years old

Dan Severn: 100-18-7 - still fighting - 53 years old

Chuck Liddell: 21-8 - 42 years old

Mirko Cro Cop: 27-10-2 - 37 years old

Rich Franklin: 28-6 - 37 years old

Randy Couture: 19-11 - 48 years old

Wanderlei Silva: 34-11-1 - still fighting - 35 years old

Jens Pulver: 25-16-1 - 37 years old

Dan Henderson: 29-8 - 41 years old - and on the verge of a title shot

 

 

 

That's all that needs to be shown.

 

 

 

 

Personally, I don't care if it gets changed or not. But if you want my honest opinion of what needs to happen, it's been said. I think it's pretty obvious. Energy loss does need sped up too, along with learning speed/aging (which means fighters decline sooner). Speeding up the game makes it more appealing to new users. At this rate, they can quit realizing they will never have a fighter like the ones at the top of the p4p rankings, come back in two years, and that fighter still be up there.

 

The idea isn't self serving at all, my best fighters are in their peaks at the ripe age of 24-25. Speeding them up to their demise is the exact opposite of what would benefit me.

[jacky67]

The idea isn't self serving at all, my best fighters are in their peaks at the ripe age of 24-25. Speeding them up to their demise is the exact opposite of what would benefit me.

 

Not really it would be perfect for you , as older fighter would moved and then ur fighter would be on top for a long time.

[silvec88]

That's all that needs to be shown.

 

 

 

 

Personally, I don't care if it gets changed or not. But if you want my honest opinion of what needs to happen, it's been said. I think it's pretty obvious. Energy loss does need sped up too, along with learning speed/aging (which means fighters decline sooner). Speeding up the game makes it more appealing to new users. At this rate, they can quit realizing they will never have a fighter like the ones at the top of the p4p rankings, come back in two years, and that fighter still be up there.

 

The idea isn't self serving at all, my best fighters are in their peaks at the ripe age of 24-25. Speeding them up to their demise is the exact opposite of what would benefit me.

 

 

http://www.fightopinion.com/2011/06/19/9-year-rule-mma-ufc/

 

As much as you want to believe that, those people started at an older age. Those are the simple facts. You don't see MMATycoon fighters starting at 34. Read the above article and it highlights a few of those fighters you named for example. But even the ones it didn't name, how relevant to the sport are the rest of those fighters? Dan Severn fights for low end organizations that at this point uses him as a seat filler due to his name. CroCop and Hughes went on HUGE downhill slides and they didn't fight from 18-40. What you're not getting is these real life examples you're using, none of them fought for 20-25 years. They fought for 10-15 at the most. By those numbers fighters created at 18 should be retiring at 33.

 

[Rambo]

http://www.fightopinion.com/2011/06/19/9-year-rule-mma-ufc/

 

As much as you want to believe that, those people started at an older age. Those are the simple facts. You don't see MMATycoon fighters starting at 34. Read the above article and it highlights a few of those fighters you named for example. But even the ones it didn't name, how relevant to the sport are the rest of those fighters? Dan Severn fights for low end organizations that at this point uses him as a seat filler due to his name. CroCop and Hughes went on HUGE downhill slides and they didn't fight from 18-40. What you're not getting is these real life examples you're using, none of them fought for 20-25 years. They fought for 10-15 at the most. By those numbers fighters created at 18 should be retiring at 33.

 

 

I feel like this supports my point?

[silvec88]

I feel like this supports my point?

 

How? It would if you wanted us to be able to create 34 year old fighters? Or if you wanted the add in of decline so at age 30 your guy fights like recent fights Chuck Liddell and getting knocked out all the time. I guess I'm just not seeing where it supports it.

[MMATycoon]

this isnt kartertycoon

I remember saying that sort of thing to a certain someone a long time ago

[MMATycoon]

Eh, most fights are like that now especially when there is high ko power involved.

I'm gunna be looking into this one pretty soon.

[silvec88]

I'm gunna be looking into this one pretty soon.

 

While I agree most fights are like that now, I don't feel they were much different when it was counter spam. It's always seemed to be very one sided to me with an occasional split decision win thrown in IMO. Might just be me.

[Rambo]

How? It would if you wanted us to be able to create 34 year old fighters? Or if you wanted the add in of decline so at age 30 your guy fights like recent fights Chuck Liddell and getting knocked out all the time. I guess I'm just not seeing where it supports it.

 

 

I wasn't trying to point out 20 year careers.

 

I was pointing at fighters/legends records, at their age, and the number of fights they have on their record? Also pointing at why all fighters shouldn't retire at 34 years old. There should be a random hidden reflecting retirement, and since people would freak out if the minimum was 9 years (which I would be completely cool with fighters randomly retiring at age 27-28 if created at 18, others won't be so receptive) I proposed "median" or whatever it's called.

 

I was basically trying to show examples of what MMATycoon Hall of Famer records should look like. Instead of all of them having 50+ wins.

[Guest]

I'm gunna be looking into this one pretty soon.

Awesome!

[silvec88]

I wasn't trying to point out 20 year careers.

 

I was pointing at fighters/legends records, at their age, and the number of fights they have on their record? Also pointing at why all fighters shouldn't retire at 34 years old. There should be a random hidden reflecting retirement, and since people would freak out if the minimum was 9 years (which I would be completely cool with fighters randomly retiring at age 27-28 if created at 18, others won't be so receptive) I proposed "median" or whatever it's called.

 

I was basically trying to show examples of what MMATycoon Hall of Famer records should look like. Instead of all of them having 50+ wins.

 

Yeah, I think as people are now packing in fights every week when they can records may get a bit out of hand. But I think if Mike can implement some sort of damage factor that this wouldn't be a problem.

 

My thoughts with a damage factor would go by damage per fight. Anderson Silva and his amazing ability to counter has allowed him to be in his prime at the point he's at now as compared to Chuck's all out war style gave him the sudden glass jaw disease at his stage. While I'm not sure I personally agree with forced retirement on a fighter, I think at some point they should have taken so much damage to be useless and that point would most likely come at before 50+ wins. I say around 30 to 40 fights average. I say the lucky few who have the great ability to not take damage that the point of no return would come around 50, maybe 60 but that's pushing it. That would be the Matt Hughes or what Anderson Silva could be example. And the low end guys who take lots of damage and go swing for the fences every fight start to deteriorate after say 20-30 or 35 fights.

 

These are obviously just very rough ideas and examples, but that's just what I have in mind. I do think everyone pulling a Dan Severn would be STUPID. It'll turn the game into MMArmy.

[jacky67]

 

 

I was pointing at fighters/legends records, at their age, and the number of fights they have on their record? Also pointing at why all fighters shouldn't retire at 34 years old. There should be a random hidden reflecting retirement,

 

 

There is one actually.

This hiddens says when ur fighter start to drop skills due to age, between 30 and 38yo don't remember well.

[DougSupreme]

I disagree. I've trained guys under the new and old systems and I have NO problems getting gains under the current system. Sure, the gains are not as easy to come by under the present system, but all my guys progress at a very reasonable rate. Btw, most of my stable consists of fighters created AFTER the training changes.

 

Another thing I can't understand for the life of me is why some of the managers who complain about training being too slow are starting their guys off at useless primaries/secondaries. Mike specifically said you could expect training to be very slow if you didn't at least start off at feeble.

 

 

At least somebody listens when Mike talks......

[Grey]

On a totally unrelated note, the banners I've seen thus far on the spoiler page are really, really ugly.

[MMATycoon]

No kidding. Hopefully now they're up more prominently, the ugly ones will put a bit more effort in!

[AlexiZaitev]

No kidding. Hopefully now they're up more prominently, the ugly ones will put a bit more effort in!

i think part of the problem is that the banners are not being made to the correct size

[DougSupreme]

i think part of the problem is that the banners are not being made to the correct size

 

where are the banners?

[MrClean]

What do RL records have to do with this game. This is a game, and if someone fights every week and winds up with 90 fights over a career and another guy fights every 3 weeks and winds up with 30 who cares? In RL the difference is nobody fights every week (3 weeks RL). If Mike wanted that part of the game to be more like RL he wouldnt be wanting people to fight more often.

 

THIS is the part of the game that I think he DOESN'T want to be like RL. Fights are what make this game fun now. Oddly enough, many people used to enjoy training, and seeing their fighters advance (me included). Since the slowdown fights are the most enjoyable part of the game and less fights means less enjoyment. I think age based decline with a small injury factor is best. I have fighters who seem to be getting KO'd more often and I think that is the way it should be. Just like Liddel, Cro cop, Hughes and numerous other fighters who once they started getting KO'd went on a downward spiral.

 

As far as KO's and dominating performances go......I REALLY hate losing, BUT I dont care (much) if I lose a split decision or get my ass whipped in the first minute of the first round. The only part of this that bothers me are NC's (which Mike has worked on) AND Draws. AGAIN, this isnt real life, and draws suck. IMO there should be a winner for EVERY fight.

 

I dont understand why training at the lower end was slowed down in the first place and I too think that part of the game should be sped back up. Maybe top end learning speed could be slowed down but I know for a fact that my top end fighters are slowed waaaaay down already. My 27-28 year old fighters are already stagnating at their current skill levels which is mostly elite boxing sensational wrestling. I would even say the opposing skill penalty is too much and could be changed. Elite muay thai and boxing is easy to maintain as is wrestling and BJJ but wrestling/boxing or opposing combinations are not. These days guys dont just have stand up skills or ground skills they are much more well rounded and the opposing skill penalty is too much. I wouldnt have a problem with slowing some things down at the top IF the opposing skill penalty was done away with or lessened: ESPECIALLY since there are KT orgs now and maybe ground orgs coming?

[Grey]

If anyone else is bothered by the banners, just add http://www.mmatycoon.com/images/company_banners/ to your AdBlock filter list.

 

And Mike, you should consider getting rid of the banners on the spoiler page. The poorly made ones make the site look really amateurish. It's a shame since the proper site is very nicely designed.

[MMATycoon]

Let's not go off topic and start talking about banners. If they stay crappy I'll do something about it.

[Grey]

Ok, that's the last thing I'll say about it.

[PBR]

I remember saying that sort of thing to a certain someone a long time ago

yea it was a rip off from you -- was funny then and still funny now -

[MrClean]

Ok, that's the last thing I'll say about it.

 

UHHH....this is the last thing you said about it

[Grey]

UHHH....this is the last thing you said about it

 

Now I can't respond to you. Oh wait, it's just happened again

[Guest]

Another thing I can't understand for the life of me is why some of the managers who complain about training being too slow are starting their guys off at useless primaries/secondaries. Mike specifically said you could expect training to be very slow if you didn't at least start off at feeble.

just so you know, i HAVE been creating my guys evened out. you guys need to quit making that argument, because it's not right. the games not set up correctly for evened out fighters. it's a contradiction and without typing out a page to explain it in detail, i'll keep it short. mike you can look at my tycoon assistant if you like to verify that im not making it up. the object of the changes was to promote evened out fighters so that you could fight directly after creation

 

well, you cant do that. because in order to fight out of the gate you've got to train strength and cardio up as you go. rather than spamming it like normal. well, that's a failing strategy. here's why

 

i train in public gyms. public gyms are suppose to hang their hat on sparring. so i spar 6 times a week. that leaves 6 other sessions open. so i train 1 time a week cardio, and 1 time a week for strength.

 

so that only leaves 4 other oppurtunities to train 11 different skills. so just stopping right there, how is a fighter suppose to make any progress? he either leaves gaping holes......or just as an example, tries to train a little of everything and trains punches on january 1st, and then trains punches again on february 3rd. --- you see, there's just not enough training oppurtunities under the current system. i've tried to say that a few times before. but it goes unnoticed. that's why the old system flourished. you could train skills consecutively and it made things **SEEM** faster. just because you could see marked improvement over a shorter time frame. just as an example: if you train something 6 times in a week or 6 times in a month and they both offer the same amount of results, which do you think will ***SEEM*** faster? the 6 times in a week of course. because you can actually see the improvement

 

bottom line - come up with a way to allow consecutive training again and the problem will be solved

 

 

 

just a follow up point

 

i think the issue is that there's no sign of improvement *in between fights*. that's one of my biggest aggrevations right now. im okay with losing a fight. that happens. but what sucks is when you:

 

lose a fight

drop down the rankings

beat a guy

move up the rankings

then lose again because you're fighters skills havent progressed

 

essentially you're just stuck for months where you cant go up or down --- i mean what are you suppose to do? how can you justify moving up in competition if your skills arent moving up with you? how can you justify playing a game where you dont see any progression?