Fight Engine Discussion

[rjs2442]

I just thought of a great idea....Fix the fucking flights before you fuck up the rest of the game.

 

Just a fucking thought!!!!!!!!!!! Getting tired of not being able to get my fighters where I need them when I want them and this has been a known fuck in the game for awhile.

Fucking BS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

no clue what this rant is on but I get my guys where they need to be without any issue. Like mad in said can u explain better?

[predicted]

 

Rico what are you one about???? Explain that better, i am not aware of a flight fuck up.

 

2 flights currently available from rio.

 

0 from sydney

[MMATycoon]

I've decided we'll just got for the full re-allocation of points, however you want. That way you don't even need to think about adjusting / training time, you can just crack on with fighting.

 

Regarding flexibility just being dropped. In real life I think it's quite important to a number of things. I'm not sure what I've programmed it into here so I will have to check. But for example, if someone gets in on a single leg, you often see people defending the takedown by lifting their leg really high and hopping around on their standing leg. Warlley Alves vs Nordine Taleb (I think it was vs him), was one obvious example of that. Warlley gets his leg basically over his head and defends the takedown. Obviously it's a combination of agility and flexibility. But someone with zero flexibility really would be more susceptible to takedowns. Plus transitions on the ground, sweeps etc sometimes need flexibility. It's hard to emulate here because some TDD and some transitions need flexibility in real life and some don't.

 

You could do a random number 0 or 1 for takedowns/transitions and sometimes look at an equation where you would benefit from flexibility and sometimes not include flexibility in the equation at all. That would be really easy to do and would be a fair approximation of real life.

Obviously subs from guard need flexibility and defending certain types of subs like armbars or kimuras needs flexibility.

 

 

 

As for planes, we couldn't replicate the error. The easiest thing we can do - if someone has a flight they want to book, pm me the flight details and i will log in as you and try to do it myself.

[shockg]

 

2 flights currently available from rio.

 

0 from sydney

 

Insta flight?

[rjs2442]

I've decided we'll just got for the full re-allocation of points, however you want. That way you don't even need to think about adjusting / training time, you can just crack on with fighting.

 

Regarding flexibility just being dropped. In real life I think it's quite important to a number of things. I'm not sure what I've programmed it into here so I will have to check. But for example, if someone gets in on a single leg, you often see people defending the takedown by lifting their leg really high and hopping around on their standing leg. Warlley Alves vs Nordine Taleb (I think it was vs him), was one obvious example of that. Warlley gets his leg basically over his head and defends the takedown. Obviously it's a combination of agility and flexibility. But someone with zero flexibility really would be more susceptible to takedowns. Plus transitions on the ground, sweeps etc sometimes need flexibility. It's hard to emulate here because some TDD and some transitions need flexibility in real life and some don't.

 

You could do a random number 0 or 1 for takedowns/transitions and sometimes look at an equation where you would benefit from flexibility and sometimes not include flexibility in the equation at all. That would be really easy to do and would be a fair approximation of real life.

Obviously subs from guard need flexibility and defending certain types of subs like armbars or kimuras needs flexibility.

 

 

 

As for planes, we couldn't replicate the error. The easiest thing we can do - if someone has a flight they want to book, pm me the flight details and i will log in as you and try to do it myself.

Just want to be clear here, it is just the physical cap changing and not the overall? Or will we have the chance to move excess points from Physicals into secondaries or what have you?

[edwardsfan]

Any considerations of expanding Elite to go beyond 150?

[MMATycoon]

Expanding elite past 150 makes absolutely no sense - it's exactly the same as just reducing the cap but would take about 10 times as long to program. If we're worried about people just neglecting flexibility and going elite in all the others, then the cap needs to be lower or we need to make sure you can't neglect flexibility. We'll do the latter and aging will do the former too.

 

rjs - you won't be doing anything to primaries or secondaries.

[Rambo]

Any considerations of expanding Elite to go beyond 150?

 

No. Dumb idea.

 

 

You do those physicals, I will beat you almost every time! I really hope guys try that, because I guarantee a few managers already know how to beat that pretty easily

 

 

It'll only be beaten easily if you can get the fight to the ground and have subs. That will likely be the standard elitist S&B build. Cutting physicals down is going to make it hell for grapplers. Grapple builds will likely end up identical, changing balance and flex.

 

flex is primarily needed for kicks, subs, and def grappling

balance impacts td def the most

speed for takedowns and striking

agility for punches and striking defense

[Rambo]

Expanding elite past 150 makes absolutely no sense - it's exactly the same as just reducing the cap but would take about 10 times as long to program. If we're worried about people just neglecting flexibility and going elite in all the others, then the cap needs to be lower or we need to make sure you can't neglect flexibility. We'll do the latter and aging will do the former too.

 

rjs - you won't be doing anything to primaries or secondaries.

 

There will always be a cookie cutter setting. Right now it's elite in everything. Doesn't matter what you do, a successful pattern will eventually spread and become the "trend"

[rjs2442]

 

rjs - you won't be doing anything to primaries or secondaries.

Thanks for clarifying

[duphus]

It'll only be beaten easily if you can get the fight to the ground and have subs. That will likely be the standard elitist S&B build. Cutting physicals down is going to make it hell for grapplers. Grapple builds will likely end up identical, changing balance and flex.

 

flex is primarily needed for kicks, subs, and def grappling

balance impacts td def the most

speed for takedowns and striking

agility for punches and striking defense

 

Someone gets it, which was my point. If everyone tries the no flex deal it will be dealt with a certain build.

[Timmy]

 

There will always be a cookie cutter setting. Right now it's elite in everything. Doesn't matter what you do, a successful pattern will eventually spread and become the "trend"

 

Not sure about that. If you can't have all elite, there will be weaknesses. A cookie build might emerge but that build will have an archilles heel that people will soon spot. Weaknesses will be uncovered as alternative ideas emerge. For example, a sprawl and brawler might become the "obvious" choice with emphasis on speed/agility/balance but that means probably no flex (sub victim), and only average strength (clinch victim vs elite strength). If you try to cover everything, you become a Bisping. That might not sound much but that is enough to make physicals relevant, and turn Tycoon into (at least) a "choice of three builds" game. I know someone will say that is just making it "stone, paper, scissors", but IMO that's better than the "Stone, stone, stone" we are playing now.

Someone said it will be worse for grapplers and I'm not sure about that either because strikers do get taken down. At the moment they typically spend about a minute on the ground, defending and spoiling, before they escape or get a stand-up. I think a minute might prove to be a long time with zero flex against a subber, or against a wrestler GnP guy who has elite balance and strength. At the very least, no one can still say, "all sens/elite physicals, job done". Capped physicals will force us to think about it, and that's more fun IMO.

[edwardsfan]

Expanding elite past 150 makes absolutely no sense - it's exactly the same as just reducing the cap but would take about 10 times as long to program. If we're worried about people just neglecting flexibility and going elite in all the others, then the cap needs to be lower or we need to make sure you can't neglect flexibility. We'll do the latter and aging will do the former too.

 

 

But....you said I had sensible ideas

 

It does make sense though. See I would like to see the cap go to 50%. But you very well can't go to 50 because the uproar would be major. So raising the cap on the top end (above 150) is simply a play on words so to speak. A subliminal way of reducing the cap

 

I was thinking about the programming part. That's why I simply asked if it was in consideration, and not trying to sell it like I normally would. I'm not a programmer. I figured that you would comment about the programming complexity. But I didn't figure that you would come in and hurt my feelings like you did

 

 

No. Dumb idea.

 

You may think it's a dumb idea simply because you don't like the idea of things being spread out. Which is fine. But the logic behind the idea is correct.

 

 

There will always be a cookie cutter setting. Right now it's elite in everything. Doesn't matter what you do, a successful pattern will eventually spread and become the "trend"

That's an advantage to going above 150. It spreads ppl farther apart. If you got a cap at 150 and a skills cap of 78%, then as high as ppl can go on agility for example is 150. Then lay the other points moderately other places. So all fighters will still most likely be collected in that window of 90 to 150. But if you have the cap on elite up to say 200. Well then you spread ppl out. You might have 50 to 200. Probably some 1's in there. Ppl will gamble to get that advantage.

 

They'll still gamble now with the cap at 78%. But imagine if the cap were at 50%? But Mike can't go to 50% because ppl would be head hunting for him. So that's why I suggest raising the cap on the other end.

 

 

 

 

Someone gets it, which was my point. If everyone tries the no flex deal it will be dealt with a certain build.

Dude, if you had any idea lol

[Bwang]

Across all the players I can see the reallocation taking a long time. I certainly have to do a lot of thinking to decide what I'm gonna do.

[Rambo]

 

Someone gets it, which was my point. If everyone tries the no flex deal it will be dealt with a certain build.

 

140+ Balance, 140+ Str, 130 cardio, 140 agility and 140 speed. The grappler with limited physicals is really going to struggle to get the fight there under the current engine, especially if balance impacts TD's in any way, shape, or form.. and top position i.e. defense for opponent on bottom trying to escape (same could be said with low flex).

 

Not saying there isn't weakness for the build, but the majority of the top 10 in every w/c will be sprawl and brawlers. The grapplers will be a gamble. the S&b builds will steal all the hype, fight each other, while the grapplers go 50/50 etc.

[Rambo]

 

You may think it's a dumb idea simply because you don't like the idea of things being spread out. Which is fine. But the logic behind the idea is correct.

 

That's an advantage to going above 150. It spreads ppl farther apart. If you got a cap at 150 and a skills cap of 78%, then as high as ppl can go on agility for example is 150. Then lay the other points moderately other places. So all fighters will still most likely be collected in that window of 90 to 150. But if you have the cap on elite up to say 200. Well then you spread ppl out. You might have 50 to 200. Probably some 1's in there. Ppl will gamble to get that advantage.

 

 

I think it's lazy programming to go above 150. Engine caps out at 150. No reason to change it. Physicals have enough of an impact on fights already, no need to give it room to make an even bigger impact.

[Erik]

 

There will always be a cookie cutter setting. Right now it's elite in everything. Doesn't matter what you do, a successful pattern will eventually spread and become the "trend"

Probably always true, but if Mike balanced the skills a bit better you'd probably see more variety.

 

Any points in Elbows these days might as well have been blown on novelty fake dog turds.

[Rambo]

Probably always true, but if Mike balanced the skills a bit better you'd probably see more variety.

 

Any points in Elbows these days might as well have been blown on novelty fake dog turds.

 

At the highest levels they're mostly useless, but only because you can have elite muay thai with abysmal knees and elbows. Otherwise they'd be much more viable.

[Guest]

 

Rico what are you one about???? Explain that better, i am not aware of a flight fuck up.

 

Scheduling an Instant Flight keeps saying I can't schedule because flight must be in future, when in fact the flights were in the future.

Been a known problem for awhile now.....But wrong thread for this, fighter is missing a fight so harm has been done.

 

Everyone carry on........

[KingEpicity]

Has anyone considered the idea of putting a cap on primaries, limiting the amount of points you can put there and letting you put more points into secondaries. This way you can have more varied builds but still have the necessary secondaries you need to compete at the top. I said it before and I will say it again, grapplers are at a disadvantage right now because the amount of points available compared to the amount of skills they need.

 

Skill you need for any build to compete at the top:

 

Punches

Kicks

Clinchwork

Striking Defense

Takedown Offense or Defense

Def Grappling

Transitions

 

Every fighter should already have these anyway, in real life and in the game.

 

Extra skills you need for stand up: Escapes, This puts you at cap pretty much if you have your physicals at elite and primaries up there at or near elite

 

Extra skills you need for a grappler: Submissions, Ground n Pound, Takedowns and really takedown defense should be an option

 

This pretty much forces you to choose between ground n pound or submissions if you want to compete at the top of the game when it reality a grappler should have both. If we are really trying to be realistic then an elite wrestler should also have takedown defense but at the moment that has to be ignored.

 

If you have a separate cap for both of those are well you could raise the secondaries and allow for another secondary to be trained up and then lower what you can do in the primaries and force people to choose between having two elites and to exceptional/wonderful primaries.

 

I literally came up with most of this while typing so it might be kinda half baked but what does everyone else think? I would also in this case you would raise the training speed for secondaries to account for the extra points available to train.

[DeadDisney]

Scheduling an Instant Flight keeps saying I can't schedule because flight must be in future, when in fact the flights were in the future.

Been a known problem for awhile now.....But wrong thread for this, fighter is missing a fight so harm has been done.

 

Everyone carry on........

You just have to set the flight about an hour or 90 min in advance.

 

It's a PITA but it's like that for now.

[Rambo]

You just have to set the flight about an hour or 90 min in advance.

 

It's a PITA but it's like that for now.

 

The day we get rid of flying in mma-fighting sim... the game takes step in the right direction. we can still keep cities, etc. for flavor and gyms.

[KingEpicity]

 

The day we get rid of flying in mma-fighting sim... the game takes step in the right direction. we can still keep cities, etc. for flavor and gyms.

 

I see your point man, I do... But ya gotta remember this isn't MMAFightingSim it's called MMATycoon. Jets do make sense in the Tycoon side of the game so it's not like they don't make sense but I gotta agree with it being nothing but a hassle. There is no satisfaction in owning a jet other than knowing you spent millions on it or you won in Spin N Win. For graphic creators like me you have the satisfaction of making the skin then after that it's still nothing but an annoyance. I guess it works as a money sink but how many people have actually bought jets recently? Hell I am pretty sure a lot of people aren't even bothering right now and just canceling their auto-flight and getting teleported for free and I don't blame them. Mike never did get back to us about confirming whether you take an energy hit or not. I am 99% sure you just get go DBZ and instant transmission to the fight.

 

If there is anyway the flying aspect of the game can be improved on I might be behind that but for me at the moment setting flights is more of a hassle than anything else.

[edwardsfan]

 

I think it's lazy programming to go above 150. Engine caps out at 150. No reason to change it. Physicals have enough of an impact on fights already, no need to give it room to make an even bigger impact.

 

That's also why I say that there shouldnt be a cap just on physicals. It puts everyone into a box. The smart idea would be to have an overall cap. That way you could go big on secondaries. Go big on primaries. Physical beast. The options would be much greater. That gives ppl that may not be as good with sliders an opportunity to be good at fighter creation.

[DavyJones]

 

At the highest levels they're mostly useless, but only because you can have elite muay thai with abysmal knees and elbows. Otherwise they'd be much more viable.

 

This is a really good point, you should not be allowed to reach elite MT with abysmal knees and elbows. The primary skills should cap depending on what level the secondaries that are associated with that primary are at.