Ticker Replacements

[minark]

"Offensive Grappling - standing up from various positions."

 

Sorry but that makes zero sense to me. Call a spade a spade. If it's getting up, call it getting up or escapes. There's no point confusing people because to me, offensive grappling is attacking the other person on the ground, be that subs, strikes, whatever.

 

Yeah, good point. I'm fine with it being called escapes. Offensive grappling just sounds more technical I guess. Lol.

 

But that's a good point and it's better to not confuse people. K.I.S.S. I guess fits this situation well.

 

**Edit - Any thoughts on the combinations stat idea?

[Showdown]

Gotta be careful about combinations. It might be more realistic, but he would also probably have to change some other things with the engine. Because if you suddenly make combinations effectively land a lot more often, you are going to have fighters dropping all over the place unless there is a big adjustment to the way damage works.

[minark]

Gotta be careful about combinations. It might be more realistic, but he would also probably have to change some other things with the engine. Because if you suddenly make combinations effectively land a lot more often, you are going to have fighters dropping all over the place unless there is a big adjustment to the way damage works.

 

Yeah, personally I think combinations in game should be slightly more powerful than a single shot but with less flash knockout power. While I know in real life it depends on the fighter and how they throw the combination or punch, the fact is that in this game all punch types are thrown with the same power. So in general, I think if you hit with combinations it should act as more of an accumulation of shots damage with the occasional flash knockout while single shots are those overhand punches that get those huge KO's.

 

And as far as accuracy I think for example sensational punches/kicks and sensational combos should offer somewhat similar results. Just as an example, say someone goes 50/50 combo vs. single shots and have sensational punches/kicks and combinations. So punches and kicks will have the flash knockout appeal and combinations will have the punches in bunches wear and tear down effect. So say this fight goes 3 full rounds and the fighter lands 75% of his punches and kicks. I think combinations should land somewhere around 65% to maybe 70%. So they're still slightly less accurate than a single shot, but they also take slightly more out of the other fighter. So it becomes an actual balance strategy between the two as one has SLIGHTLY more power and the other has SLIGHTLY more accuracy with a slighty higher chance of flash KO's.

 

Just an idea. I'd love to see someone branch an idea off of it and come up with something more refined because I know I'm not great with explanations and there are a lot of intelligent people on here who have come up with great ideas out of small not so great concepts.

[minark]

So I'm going to try to put some numbers to this idea.

 

I'm going to break the two down into three categories, damage, accuracy and KO's.

 

First I'll start with damage. I'm not a mathmetician or anything so if I get something completely wrong, please someone jump in and set me straight by all means.

 

I think damage should go with a slight edge to combinations. So on a scale of 100 per say, I would put combinations at a 51-52% damage which leaves single shots at 48-49% damage. So just for my terrible math skills sake, say a person has 100 health. The opponent lands 25 single strikes throughout the fight and it takes away around 48% health. If that fighter would have landed 25 combination strikes he would have taken away around 52% of the fighters health.

 

Now with accuracy it'd be about the opposite. So as an example, fighter A throws 100 single strikes in a fight and lands 51 or 52 strikes. If fighter A had set those all the way to combinations he would have hit 48 or 49 combinations.

 

With flash KO's, I honestly don't know how they are decided in this game. So this is where I have the biggest problem, but if they were also on a scale similar to that of strikes I would give single shots probably closer to 55% chance of getting the flash KO compared to 45% for combinations. So if it takes 55 combination strikes before a flash KO happened in a fight, with the same fight set to all single shots, the flash KO would have happened around the 49 strike mark. I think that comes to about a 10% difference.

 

If this makes no sense, I understand. Just trying to put some numbers to my idea and see what people think,

[Warwynd]

Just for clarity, I don't think Chris was butthurt about the name Escapes. I think he just thought there could be better nomenclature used.

 

 

(at least that was the impression I got)

 

I didn't mean to imply that Chris was "butthurt". Simply saying that I agreed with his statements and that I wouldn't be upset regardless of the name used. Just to clarify.

[DougSupreme]

I didn't mean to imply that Chris was "butthurt". Simply saying that I agreed with his statements and that I wouldn't be upset regardless of the name used. Just to clarify.

 

Just to clarify, I was't saying Chris WAS butthurt, nor that you implied it. I was just trying to clarify it to the people that may have taken it wrong.

[Stu_Pidasol]

Lets not too off track here - there is so many sliders where you are only going to use a certain range.. hopefully I'm talking about the same thing as you guys as i haven't read everything.

 

High Kicks / Low kicks

single shots / combos

try takedowns / stay standing

try to clinch / stay on the outside

 

I fail to see why we want to add combo etc etc etc to try and make better use of the sliders (AT THIS MOMENT AMYWAY).. I understand the talk about grapplers needed to be had and ways to make them slightly more efective definitely relavent in a thread about fighter creation..

 

Lets get the rise, peak, fall of fighters sorted along with build divseristy (It's a 1 man show remember) and then Mike can start looking at these other improvements.

 

Escapes to me sounds like the best way to kill a lot of birds with one stone especially if ref stand ups are toned down and the striker is forced to actually get out and stand rather than waiting for the ref to save him.

 

Escapes would not be needed by ground fighters as there would probably be only some very rare occassions where a ground fighter wouldn't want to stay on the mat. So it basically adds a skill a striker most definitely needs and means the things even up a little more between strikers and grapplers.

 

Add this to the fact that total skill points is coming down (hopefully less than the 80%) and finally this game may start to see some diversity instead of a bunch of clones going head to head with hiddens being the biggest decider between fighters and managers

[minark]

Lets not too off track here - there is so many sliders where you are only going to use a certain range.. hopefully I'm talking about the same thing as you guys as i haven't read everything.

 

High Kicks / Low kicks

single shots / combos

try takedowns / stay standing

try to clinch / stay on the outside

 

I fail to see why we want to add combo etc etc etc to try and make better use of the sliders (AT THIS MOMENT AMYWAY).. I understand the talk about grapplers needed to be had and ways to make them slightly more efective definitely relavent in a thread about fighter creation..

 

Lets get the rise, peak, fall of fighters sorted along with build divseristy (It's a 1 man show remember) and then Mike can start looking at these other improvements.

 

Escapes to me sounds like the best way to kill a lot of birds with one stone especially if ref stand ups are toned down and the striker is forced to actually get out and stand rather than waiting for the ref to save him.

 

Escapes would not be needed by ground fighters as there would probably be only some very rare occassions where a ground fighter wouldn't want to stay on the mat. So it basically adds a skill a striker most definitely needs and means the things even up a little more between strikers and grapplers.

 

Add this to the fact that total skill points is coming down (hopefully less than the 80%) and finally this game may start to see some diversity instead of a bunch of clones going head to head with hiddens being the biggest decider between fighters and managers

 

Yeah, escapes is 1 but Mike wants to add 2 skills to get it down to the 80%. That's where I was suggesting combos.

 

And I only think it would be a good add because if we want 2 skills I can't think of anything better than escapes and combos. Escapes speaks for itself as it's something the game definitely needs. As for combos, it just makes sense to me to make them a viable option. The combo slider is similar to the clinch slider in the way that if you go anything over 90% one way, it's a death wish. I just think combos are MUCH more prevalant in real life than single shots at the top, but in this game it's the opposite, so by doing something with those it would help to even out the drastic gap between single shots and combos.

[DavyJones]

Escapes is a legitimate term used in both bjj and wrestling, just google "bjj escapes" and "wrestling escapes" and you get thousands of hits. I think its a perfect fit personally.

[Rambo]

Just kind of confused, so don't be surprised if any of the following is confusing, or slightly contradicts itself...

 

Just for clarity, I don't think Chris was butthurt about the name Escapes. I think he just thought there could be better nomenclature used.

 

 

(at least that was the impression I got)

 

Yeah, this.... and the fact that I thought "escapes" was already part of defensive grappling, makes it a bit more confusing to me.

 

As for the it wouldn't look weird if it was here from the beginning, well any stat, no matter how strange or crazy it was, wouldn't look weird if it was here from the beginning lol. But maybe not.

 

"Offensive Grappling - standing up from various positions."

 

Sorry but that makes zero sense to me. Call a spade a spade. If it's getting up, call it getting up or escapes. There's no point confusing people because to me, offensive grappling is attacking the other person on the ground, be that subs, strikes, whatever.

 

Offensive grappling could be a few different things, but I agree with that... and to me, defensive grappling is escaping off the ground, defending submissions/strikes, controlling position from the bottom, and preventing top position advancement.

 

With most skills in this game it seems you need it to defend it. I just don't see how escapes is essential or not covered already. All of my fighters will have useless-- escapes because most of them have great defensive grappling. Who needs to escape? Try to escape so the ref let's us stay on the ground cuz I'm trying to get my fighter to the feet or risk the fighter on top improving position or landing shots? No thanks. Will your wrestler need to know escapes to prevent fighters from the bottom from escaping? I'm confused on how the process will work. Escapes seems extremely one dimensional and purely defensive. Unlike elbows/knees that can finish a fighter who is useless in them, I don't see how a seperate escape skill will be essential.

 

While I was thinking Offensive grappling would be advancing position and maybe any offensive grappling manuever, maybe a small contribution to strikes, subs, whatever. Defensive grappling would be defensive - whether it's holding on for dear life and lookin at the ref for help, trying to escape to your feet, defending subs, whatever... but apparently we're removing the escaping aspect from defensive grappling?

 

Is escaping off the ground offensive or defensive? If it's defensive, shouldn't that be covered by defensive grappling? Hasn't it always been covered by defensive grappling? It seems like it would be similar to making combos and punch technique two different statistics, or striking defense and head movement, cardio and energy recovery...

 

 

The whole idea of escapes just confuses me. Of course I know what the hell an escape is, and what it will do... but it seems pretty useless to have, or pretty pointless to even try to escape, unless you have a major engine overhaul with the ground game + the ref stand ups.

 

 

Just confusing man, that's all.

 

"Offensive Grappling - standing up from various positions."

 

Sorry but that makes zero sense to me.

 

Comes down to this, is escaping offensive or defensive? Because escaping is strictly a grappling statistic, and only used when grappling, so if it isn't offensive then it's defensive, shouldn't it be covered by defensive grappling? - which I've always been under the impression that it has been since the beginning. Offensive grappling could be advancing position period, top or bottom, and cover escapes too?

 

Offensive Grappling = Wrestling/BJJ

 

what the hell is escapes ? Wrestling? BJJ? Circuits/athletic? lol...

 

 

and for anybody who says escaping is a wrestling related secondary, most wrestlers hate being on their backs and aren't very good at escaping. Fighters that escape from the ground are usually extremely athletic, and/or due to the top fighter not controlling the fighter on the bottom effectively.

Edited November 20, 2012 by CKeppelrun

[PBR]

The whole idea of escapes just confuses me. Of course I know what the hell an escape is, and what it will do... but it seems pretty useless to have, or pretty pointless to even try to escape, unless you have a major engine overhaul with the ground game + the ref stand ups.

 

personally thats the way i think it needs to be -- ref stand ups should rarely happen (not saying never but no where close to the way they are now) -- i think this could be done by redoing the ref stand ups making people use the stand up slider side more -- if it needs overhauled to do this then so be but i dont think it would just need to redo the ref stand up part -- thus making ref stand ups rare and that will make fighters have to stand on their on, like its done in real life more -- i dont think this would require a major overhaul at all

 

edited: like i stated in other post just cause sliders and game engine allow it to be done (high control for stand up) doesnt mean its alright like the 100% counter deal just cause sliders and game engine allowed it it wasnt correct

[Rambo]

Escapes is a legitimate term used in both bjj and wrestling, just google "bjj escapes" and "wrestling escapes" and you get thousands of hits. I think its a perfect fit personally.

 

Yeah, and so is sweeps, or sweeping. Should we make that a seperate attribute? It'd sure as hell make more sense than escapes, because what kind of primary is escapes related to? At least with sweeps it'd be wrestling/bjj but isn't that covered by defensive grappling?

 

Escapes seems like a completely pointless skill because isn't it already covered by defensive grappling?

 

well watched 3 full events this weekend (little over 30 fights) -- all 3 events had lots of ground work in them and not 1 ref stand up in any of them -- fighters escaped or grappled their way up but wasnt 1 ref stand up

 

personally thats the way i think it needs to be -- ref stand ups should rarely happen (not saying never but no where close to the way they are now) -- i think this could be done by redoing the ref stand ups making people use the stand up slider side more -- if it needs overhauled to do this then so be but i dont think it would just need to redo the ref stand up part -- thus making ref stand ups rare and that will make fighters have to stand on their on, like its done in real life more -- i dont think this would require a major overhaul at all

 

edited: like i stated in other post just cause sliders and game engine allow it to be done doesnt mean its alright like the 100% counter deal just cause sliders and game engine allowed it it wasnt correct

 

So, you think we need to add a new skill because the ref stand up frequency needs looked at? I don't get it.

[PBR]

So, you think we need to add a new skill because the ref stand up frequency needs looked at? I don't get it.

 

guess you didnt read my post

 

i think this could be done by redoing the ref stand ups making people use the stand up slider side more

 

just need to redo the ref stand up part -- thus making ref stand ups rare and that will make fighters have to stand on their on, like its done in real life more

 

 

edited: i know some people are worried about more skills being added or sliders cause they are worried about not or having to figure them out -- why be worried about it -- everyone will have to do the same thing

 

the part with skills being added is to bring the one 90% fighter down to 80% since everyone is so worried about their fighter getting cut back -- so it has to be done to accomplish it without cutting fighters skills -- two new skills have to be add --- not saying escapes or any other skill should be the one added just stating why 2 skills need to be added --- would be much easier if people wouldnt worry so much on fighters getting skills cut then no new skills would be needed -- change isnt so scary and sometimes its a good thing

[Rambo]

guess you didnt read my post

 

 

 

 

 

 

edited: i know some people are worried about more skills being added or sliders cause they are worried about not or having to figure them out -- why be worried about it -- everyone will have to do the same thing

 

the part with skills being added is to bring the one 90% fighter down to 80% since everyone is so worried about their fighter getting cut back -- so it has to be done to accomplish it without cutting fighters skills -- two new skills have to be add --- not saying escapes or any other skill should be the one added just stating why 2 skills need to be added --- would be much easier if people wouldnt worry so much on fighters getting skills cut then no new skills would be needed -- change isnt so scary and sometimes its a good thing

 

I'm worried about it not making any sense what-so-ever. Let's add skills that make no sense. That makes sense!

 

Here's my quick fix:

 

- Use the injury hidden as a way to push fighters into retirement through declining skill and reduced fight performances

- Keep the skills as they are now, don't add anything new

- Remove current tickers

- Implement the "behind the scenes" ticker system with a random skill "cap" based on fighter's Intelligence hidden

- Increase the training speed from Useless to Wonderful

[PBR]

soyster89 comments are fine but still doesnt get the 90% down to 80% or the other fighters about 80% down below it does it? -- thus the reason to add 2 new skills -- what skills would like to see added -- instead of downing everyone elses idea come up with one -- personally i dont care if any skill is added and i rather just take a cut on my fighters skills but some dont want that to happen so two skills have to be added to achieve the % mark

[minark]

soyster89 comments are fine but still doesnt get the 90% down to 80% or the other fighters about 80% down below it does it? -- thus the reason to add 2 new skills -- what skills would like to see added -- instead of downing everyone elses idea come up with one -- personally i dont care if any skill is added and i rather just take a cut on my fighters skills but some dont want that to happen so two skills have to be added to achieve the % mark

 

I would much rather take the cut on my fighter skills also, but I figure if something new is going to be added I might as well make the best out of it. I like the idea of adding 2 new skills, I just wish we could come up with a good list to choose from. Whatever way it goes, I will adapt, but for now I'm just going to keep trying to think of ideas towards whatever change Mike seems to be leaning to. Right now Mike seems to be leaning towards 2 more stats.

[Guest]

I don't like this idea of "escape" as a new skill. If the idea is to create a new ground skill in order to fix the gap between strikers and grapplers, what about to create something more specialized and that we still do not have in the game?

 

I mean, the "escape" idea was always part of the defensive grappling skill, at least the way most people think about defensive grappling, no? So I don't see a point in create a skill that will does something that it is already perfectly covered by other skill (defensive grap).

 

Well, I have another idea (if you don't like it, I'm ok with that, it's just an idea). What about to create two new skills, that will be influenced to the other ground skills we already have in game, like defensive grappling, submission and ground n pound? This way, all the skills we already have would still be important as well and with new skills we would fix a litle bit the gap between strikers and grapplers.

 

I was thinking that you could add two skills:

 

- ground on top

- ground on bottom

 

Everyone who fights some ground style of fighting (mma ground training, bjj with gi training, without the gi, sambo, ne waza in judo, etc) will agree that some fighters are killers on top but terrible on bottom. The same way, there is fighters who are extremelly skillful on the bottom but are not so dangerous on the top.

 

Especially in MMA, it's very different to fight on top and to fight on the bottom. You can have a monster fighter that can takedown the opponent and smash him with a nasty ground n pound, but that isn't good on bottom (there's a lot of fighters like this in RL).

 

So, the ground on top skill would raise or decrease (if the skill is high, would raise, if it's low would decrease) the effectivness of def grap, submission and ground n pound whe the fighter is on top and the ground on bottom would raise or decrease the def grap and submission on the bottom. Also, the ground on top skill would increase/decrease the chance of a successful advance position on top. And the ground on bottom skill would increase/decrease the chance of a successful advance position on bottom.

 

This way, you would have more alternative in the ground game and more diversity in the build of the fighters, plus definitely these new skills would be important in the ground game which possibly could fix the gap between strikers and grapplers.

[minark]

I don't like this idea of "escape" as a new skill. If the idea is to create a new ground skill in order to fix the gap between strikers and grapplers, what about to create something more specialized and that we still do not have in the game?

 

I mean, the "escape" idea was always part of the defensive grappling skill, at least the way most people think about defensive grappling, no? So I don't see a point in create a skill that will does something that it is already perfectly covered by other skill (defensive grap).

 

Well, I have another idea (if you don't like it, I'm ok with that, it's just an idea). What about to create two new skills, that will be influenced to the other ground skills we already have in game, like defensive grappling, submission and ground n pound? This way, all the skills we already have would still be important as well and with new skills we would fix a litle bit the gap between strikers and grapplers.

 

I was thinking that you could add two skills:

 

- ground on top

- ground on bottom

 

Everyone who fights some ground style of fighting (mma ground training, bjj with gi training, without the gi, sambo, ne waza in judo, etc) will agree that some fighters are killers on top but terrible on bottom. The same way, there is fighters who are extremelly skillful on the bottom but are not so dangerous on the top.

 

Especially in MMA, it's very different to fight on top and to fight on the bottom. You can have a monster fighter that can takedown the opponent and smash him with a nasty ground n pound, but that isn't good on bottom (there's a lot of fighters like this in RL).

 

So, the ground on top skill would raise or decrease (if the skill is high, would raise, if it's low would decrease) the effectivness of def grap, submission and ground n pound whe the fighter is on top and the ground on bottom would raise or decrease the def grap and submission on the bottom. Also, the ground on top skill would increase/decrease the chance of a successful advance position on top. And the ground on bottom skill would increase/decrease the chance of a successful advance position on bottom.

 

This way, you would have more alternative in the ground game and more diversity in the build of the fighters, plus definitely these new skills would be important in the ground game which possibly could fix the gap between strikers and grapplers.

 

Only problem is this does the opposite of decreasing the gap between strikers and ground fighters. Currently ground fighters have more skills that they need as compared to strikers. Essentially what this is doing is giving ground fighters two more skills and not adding anything to the striker. At the most it adds one to the striker who might get ground bottom skill just to advance and escape and still make the ground fighter have both skills. So this really would do the opposite of what everyone is trying to accomplish.

[Guest]

Only problem is this does the opposite of decreasing the gap between strikers and ground fighters. Currently ground fighters have more skills that they need as compared to strikers. Essentially what this is doing is giving ground fighters two more skills and not adding anything to the striker. At the most it adds one to the striker who might get ground bottom skill just to advance and escape and still make the ground fighter have both skills. So this really would do the opposite of what everyone is trying to accomplish.

 

Well, not that much. We can pull guard in the clinch, right? So, if I fight against someone who is good only at bottom, then I just need to pull guard and kill the guy from there, because he will be on top. If the guy is good on top, then I need to take him down or pul guard and then sweep, then the guy is gone. I believe this way strikers would have to train both skills and if not, they would be weak in one ground aspect and grapplers could take advantage of this. This way, it would decrease the gap between strikers and grapplers.

 

And this argument you used it applies to every new ground skill that possibly would be created. If you create the "escape" skill, ground fighters would definitely need it too. Every new ground skill that you create, a grappler fight would need to, considering they fight in the ground.

[PBR]

- ground on top

- ground on bottom

 

i see where your going with it -- we have the ground top or bottom slider -- but what really was looking for was really more pure defensive ground skills for stand up fighters-- where a ground fighter might need little of it but not near what a stand up fighter would need (sort of like a ground fighter needing takedown d - its not something they would care to have as a really high skill) -- or at least 1 of them to be that preferably both i think though

 

edited: i think it would have to be looked at much more in depth but not sure how feel on it though

[minark]

I really think this entire issue would be less of a problem if offense wasn't needed in order to defend things. Is it less realistic? Yes, but in a game perspective it makes things so much simpler.

 

Punch Technique

Punch Defense

Kick

Kick Defense

Clinchwork (Can still cover both aspects if needed or could add a clinchwork defense.)

Knees

Knee Defense

Elbow

Elbow Defense

Takedowns

Takedown Defense

Ground Striking

Ground Striking Defense

Submissions

Subimssion Defense.

Offensive Grappling

Defensive Grappling

 

Yes, I know this will never happen. It's too many secondary stats for many people, it would just make the game much simpler as everything would be laid out with an offense and a defense and we wouldn't have to worry about what stat covers offense only and what stat covers offense and defense and how much of an impact it has on each side.

 

But imagine this, 4 primary skills, 17-18 secondaries and 6 physicals. That's a total of 27-28 stats. This would have 4200 stat points possible. Now the first thing I would do in this situation is an increase to training s peed. Personally I think it should take about 6 months training for a somewhat fast learner to be reaching 70% and probably about 9-10 months to reach 80%. We'll say about 12-14 months for an average learner. The cap would be between 75%-80% depending on a hidden. So it speeds the game up as it takes 9-10 months to be competing at the very top as compared to 2 years now. So it's still a slow moving game that takes time and strategy, but it's also sped up for the people who want drastic speed increases. So in total, 3360 skill points would be about the most skill points possible.

 

So, the learning speed would be pretty drastically increased but not so much that it becomes MMArmy. Now at the same time, make 1 in game year slightly faster. I think in those 9-10 months where you've been training you should gain about 5 years on your fighter. An 18 year old would be 22-23 at this point. Still very young. He'd have probably another year and 8-9-10 months at this level of quality fighting. For this the game year would need to be sped up only 2 weeks to 10 weeks. So the fighter would be cycled out in about 13 to 14 game years and be fighting near the top for 8-9 game years.

 

So in turn, more skills meaning faster learning speed, more stat pops for those managers bored of not popping, faster cycles in and out for fighters and in essence every stat has it's own defense you would need leaving you to choose what type of offensive fighter you want to be.

 

Just a thought. Realistically, I know this won't happen but to me it just seems like such a less complicated thing to deal with. I don't like that this game has turned into fighters needing every stat because every offense is now also defense. Ah well.

[minark]

And just for a mental image if I did my math right, that would mean you could be sensational at all 9 defenses, all 4 primaries and all 6 physicals and have 890 points or so left over. So that comes out to roughly being at a 99/superb++ skill in all offensive stats or 111/wonderful-- in 8 offensive stats and useless in 1. Last example would be 127/exceptional+ in 7 skills and useless in 2 skills. Now I only used sensational in all defense to make for easier math, but basically you could have 19 skills at sensational and the rest could still get relatively high. As you begin to specialize your fighters you'll notice that it gives you more stats in that area if you decide to ignore something else.

[ajperok]

Have any of you ever actually wrestled? Seriously.

 

The skill involved in a "reversal/sweep" are not the same skills used in a "escape", nor are these the skills at all involved in just laying there looking to stall.

-Those are 3 entirely different skill sets - and yes, laying there stalling out is a tactic.

 

and Takedown Defense would be separate also.

 

 

 

Whether it's realistic to make them all separate secondaries or not? I don't know, but much of the talk above isn't correct.

[soyster89]

soyster89 comments are fine but still doesnt get the 90% down to 80% or the other fighters about 80% down below it does it? -- thus the reason to add 2 new skills -- what skills would like to see added -- instead of downing everyone elses idea come up with one -- personally i dont care if any skill is added and i rather just take a cut on my fighters skills but some dont want that to happen so two skills have to be added to achieve the % mark

 

So, I should have clarified in my original post - I don't think we need to drop skills at all, and I sure as heck don't think we need two new skills. Instead, we allow fighters to be "God-like" in our current state, and we use injuries as a means of pushing the elite level era out and usher in the new, random skill capped era.

 

Knee-jerk reactions rarely work, and I feel like a 10% skill cut or adding 2 new skills is exactly that - knee jerk. Instead, my proposal fixes the current state (declining fighters pushed into retirement because of thier injury hidden, and whatever Mike currently uses with age) as well as the future state (random skill cap behind the scenes, removal of tickers, and faster training from Useless to Wonderful).

 

- Use the injury hidden as a way to push fighters into retirement through declining skill and reduced fight performances

- Keep the skills as they are now, don't add anything new

- Remove current tickers

- Implement the "behind the scenes" ticker system with a random skill "cap" based on fighter's Intelligence hidden

- Increase the training speed from Useless to Wonderful

 

***EDIT***

 

One last thing - if I'm forced to pick between the two, I take a 10% skill reduction over adding new skills. If adding new skills gets us to the 10% thing anyways, why not just take a 10% hit and not change the entire landscape of the game.

[Warwynd]

 

So, the learning speed would be pretty drastically increased but not so much that it becomes MMArmy. Now at the same time, make 1 in game year slightly faster. I think in those 9-10 months where you've been training you should gain about 5 years on your fighter. An 18 year old would be 22-23 at this point. Still very young. He'd have probably another year and 8-9-10 months at this level of quality fighting. For this the game year would need to be sped up only 2 weeks to 10 weeks. So the fighter would be cycled out in about 13 to 14 game years and be fighting near the top for 8-9 game years.

 

 

I am totally opposed to shortening the game year any more than it already is. It runs counter to the speeding up of training. Losing two weeks per game year will only wident the gap between newer players and those that benefitted rom the longer game years. When the game year was 17 weeks long (?) that translated to 204 training session per game year (not counting the Sunday rest sessions). To say nothing of the fact that they also benefitted much more from one-on-one training with Elite coaches back then. When I started playing the game the year length was 13 weeks per game year. which was only 156 training sessions per game year and the training speed was slowed down. A few months after I began playing the year was shortened to 12 weeks per year which resulted in another 24 training sessions per game year lost. The training also underwent some more changes to make it a bit faster, but the net result was negligible.

 

What you are talking about doing would cost us even more traing time shortening the year to 10 week would mean a mere 120 training session per game year and would completely counter any advantages gained by speeding up training. 12 weeks works just fine. It helps keep things neat and tidy (and makes RP easier, since all you got to do is count back weeks to be able to tell exactly how long ago something happened, but I know that is only a seconadary, at best, goal.) I will never understand how people think that shortening the game year will help in any way. It only hurts the game. Not only does it have a deleterious effect on training, but it also means that after having worked my ass off to get my fighter up to where he is that now, due to the faster game year, that he will be forced to retire sooner.

 

The rest of this post I liked. I too think that it will not happen as it is a massive overhaul of pretty much the entire game, but I think it makes lots of sence with the exception of the game year length.

 

So, I should have clarified in my original post - I don't think we need to drop skills at all, and I sure as heck don't think we need two new skills. Instead, we allow fighters to be "God-like" in our current state, and we use injuries as a means of pushing the elite level era out and usher in the new, random skill capped era.

 

Knee-jerk reactions rarely work, and I feel like a 10% skill cut or adding 2 new skills is exactly that - knee jerk. Instead, my proposal fixes the current state (declining fighters pushed into retirement because of thier injury hidden, and whatever Mike currently uses with age) as well as the future state (random skill cap behind the scenes, removal of tickers, and faster training from Useless to Wonderful).

 

- Use the injury hidden as a way to push fighters into retirement through declining skill and reduced fight performances

- Keep the skills as they are now, don't add anything new

- Remove current tickers

- Implement the "behind the scenes" ticker system with a random skill "cap" based on fighter's Intelligence hidden

- Increase the training speed from Useless to Wonderful

 

***EDIT***

 

One last thing - if I'm forced to pick between the two, I take a 10% skill reduction over adding new skills. If adding new skills gets us to the 10% thing anyways, why not just take a 10% hit and not change the entire landscape of the game.

 

I will not be affected directly by a skill cut across the board. In fact, I would be in a much better position by that happening since none of my fighters even require maintenance anymore, but I do understand why there are those who would be affected by it to be concerned. To have the axe brought down overnight would seem rather harsh.

 

Adding the new skills would actually hurt me pretty badly as all my standup guys would need to spread their skill points around then focusa on ground skills again, but if the guys that would be affected by the skills being cut want, then who am I to complain. I am in favor of finding a way to be as fair as possible to all sides without turning their favorite fighter or long time project into garbage overnight. I am OK with whatever way Mike decides to go as long as it does not involve a shortening of the game year. I honestly think that, that is the one thing that will make me quite this game.